My Dad Had Cancer. I Thought We Had More Time. | Dead Dads Podcast | Grief Support for Men

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Speaker 0: He had this shocked look on his face, and I realized that he hadn't

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Speaker 0: really asked those detailed questions Yeah.

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Speaker 0: Where I think it was by now.

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Speaker 0: It was, like, end of November.

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Speaker 0: And they're pretty much if you do chemo, you probably got six months.

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Speaker 0: If you don't do chemo, you probably got three.

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Speaker 0: And I was like, okay.

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Speaker 1: Losing your dad sucks, but talking about it doesn't have to.

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Speaker 2: We are not therapists professionally.

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Speaker 2: We may like to think we are, but we are not.

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Speaker 0: We give really good advice though.

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Speaker 1: Mhmm.

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Speaker 1: Just not medically or therapeutically.

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Speaker 1: Although if you do feel better after it,

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Speaker 0: that's okay.

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Speaker 0: You can still you can still listen to us.

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Speaker 2: But we will bill you for that.

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Speaker 2: We're also not doctors.

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Speaker 0: That's true.

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Speaker 1: We're definitely not doctors.

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Speaker 1: I once was a doctor, but then was immediately removed from

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Speaker 1: doctor status.

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Speaker 2: You just had a lab coat on.

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Speaker 2: Like, that's not a doctor.

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Speaker 0: That that was the problem.

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Speaker 1: Enjoy the next episode of Dead Dads.

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Speaker 2: I wanna introduce you because this is a person that I, I know.

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Speaker 1: You're bringing to the table?

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Speaker 2: I'm bringing to the table today.

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Speaker 2: This is Tiff Daniels.

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Speaker 1: Hey, Tiff.

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Speaker 0: How are you guys doing?

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Speaker 0: Fantastic.

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Speaker 0: Welcome to

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Speaker 1: your Dead Dads.

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Speaker 1: Thank you.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to Dead Dads.

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Speaker 0: For having me.

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Speaker 2: Tiff, little bit of a spoiler alert because we did talk about this before.

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Speaker 2: I know we're gonna ask you a couple of questions, but the first question

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Speaker 2: that I'm interested in is, for for those of you that don't know, we're

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Speaker 2: relatively new to the podcast game.

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Speaker 2: Mhmm.

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Speaker 2: This is a concept that Roger and I came up with not that long

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Speaker 2: ago

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Speaker 0: Right.

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Speaker 2: As we're processing the grief of our own fathers, and we were thinking that

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Speaker 2: there just is not a lot of room in this space.

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Speaker 2: Not a lot of people who are talking about this.

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Speaker 0: Mhmm.

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Speaker 0: So

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Speaker 2: we did a post on LinkedIn thinking, I wonder who's out there that's interested.

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Speaker 2: And, Tiff, you were the first.

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Speaker 2: You were the first person.

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Speaker 2: You you, almost, it might have been, but it didn't seem.

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Speaker 2: You almost didn't hesitate.

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Speaker 0: Right.

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Speaker 0: You came

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Speaker 2: up and said and we looked for people that wanted to come and talk.

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Speaker 0: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: And you said, yeah.

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Speaker 2: I'll do that.

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Speaker 2: You came up.

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Speaker 2: You messaged me.

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Speaker 2: I asked you if you were willing to chat.

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Speaker 2: We chatted.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So I'm wondering, firstly, when you read that post,

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Speaker 2: what inspired you to come and do that?

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Speaker 2: Because we don't know each other that well.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So you're you're basically offering yourself up to be, you know, somebody new for

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Speaker 2: a podcast.

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Speaker 2: I'd like to know what was your inspiration?

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Speaker 0: Well, it's it's funny because prior to this all starting, you talked about tears

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Speaker 0: and getting emotional.

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Speaker 0: Now I almost feel like I might get emotional now, but I think it's

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Speaker 0: because my father meant so much to me.

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Speaker 2: Right.

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Speaker 0: And I'm a father now too.

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Speaker 0: And I think about every day about what I learned

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Speaker 0: from him that I can pass on to my children or be a better

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Speaker 0: person to be a good dad, that kind of thing.

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Speaker 0: So I just saw it, and I thought that just made sense to me

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Speaker 0: to

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Speaker 0: to talk about my story, but I'm sure there's other people out there that

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Speaker 0: have had some similar stories, shall we say.

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Speaker 0: So

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Speaker 1: Well, we're really looking forward to learning more about your dad.

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Speaker 1: Mhmm.

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Speaker 1: But first, we wanna learn more about you.

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Speaker 1: Sure.

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Speaker 1: So let me ask you a question.

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Speaker 1: When you get home at a at the end of the day, have had

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Speaker 1: a stressful day Mhmm.

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Speaker 1: What's something you like to watch or listen to that just calms you down?

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Speaker 1: Well,

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Speaker 0: I work from home.

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Speaker 0: Okay.

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Speaker 0: So I'm always home.

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Speaker 0: More I'm home a lot.

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Speaker 0: I mean, I go out for meetings and stuff like that.

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Speaker 0: And it's funny you say that because what calms me down if I'm working

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Speaker 0: home, I'm at home, my my wife's a teacher, she'll be off.

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Speaker 0: I might be doing the laundry.

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Speaker 0: When I'm folding laundry, I'm listening to a podcast.

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Speaker 0: Love it.

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Speaker 0: So Yeah.

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Speaker 0: I've just kinda gotten into that little bit.

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Speaker 2: To that five dollar bill before

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Speaker 0: anything because it's really

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Speaker 2: working out.

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Speaker 0: Yeah.

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Speaker 0: Exactly.

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Speaker 0: So that keeps me calm and relaxed and everything like that.

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Speaker 0: But,

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Speaker 0: yeah.

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Speaker 2: Do you have favorites?

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Speaker 2: Ones that you listen to a lot?

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Speaker 0: I'm sure you've heard stuff you should know.

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Speaker 0: Oh, I am.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Every dad should listen to stuff you should know.

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Speaker 0: I just I've I don't know how I got into it a couple years

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Speaker 0: ago, and I've just listened to it.

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Speaker 0: I'm like, some of the topics are interesting.

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Speaker 0: The two guys that run it are they do a good job.

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Speaker 0: So let's talk about your dad.

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Speaker 0: Yep.

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Speaker 1: What was his name?

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Speaker 1: George.

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Speaker 1: George.

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Speaker 1: Yep.

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Speaker 1: And how long ago did he pass?

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Speaker 1: Three years ago.

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Speaker 0: Oh, sorry.

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Speaker 0: Almost three years ago.

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Speaker 0: It was February twenty twenty two.

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Speaker 0: So, yeah, that's almost three years.

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Speaker 1: So I'm wondering if you could start off by sharing, you know, maybe a

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Speaker 1: little story about, something that really captures his personality

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Speaker 1: and and and who he was.

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Speaker 0: Well, I think George, if I'm correct, in Greek

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Speaker 0: means farmer.

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Speaker 0: So he though he wasn't a farmer, he loved to, you know,

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Speaker 0: he loved gardening, loved to have his vegetable patch in the

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Speaker 0: so that was very much who he was.

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Speaker 0: And I I realized, when before coming here, Scott was saying, bring some mementos

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Speaker 0: if you want.

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Speaker 0: I was looking for this photograph that actually was on that's

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Speaker 0: not the photograph there, but another one that was actually of him and,

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Speaker 0: like, Oshkosh overalls.

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Speaker 1: Oh, like

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Speaker 2: the old fashioned Yeah.

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Speaker 2: The old

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Speaker 0: fashioned overall?

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Speaker 0: Exactly.

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Speaker 0: Oh, Oshkosh.

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Speaker 0: He had a pair of those that he literally probably had since before I

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Speaker 0: was born, but he was still wearing them until just, you know, the last

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Speaker 0: year of his life when he'd go work in the garden, in the

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Speaker 0: summer times.

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Speaker 0: So but it's a great photo of him really smiling and happy, and I

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Speaker 0: think it was on the cover of the the pamphlet at his, his

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Speaker 0: funeral Funeral.

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Speaker 0: And everything like that.

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Speaker 2: He liked that as far as you can remember.

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Speaker 2: Like, when you're a kid, was he always outside doing gardening stuff?

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Speaker 2: Did that come to him a bit later?

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Speaker 0: I think it a little bit later because he was probably really busy with

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Speaker 0: work and family when he was younger.

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Speaker 0: But as he got to retirement, that was a big thing for him was

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Speaker 0: the gardening.

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Speaker 0: But I think he'd always had that that, green thumb.

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Speaker 2: Did you pick that up

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Speaker 0: from him?

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Speaker 0: No.

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Speaker 0: Not really.

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Speaker 0: Well, maybe a little bit because I used to be a landscaper, and I

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Speaker 0: love mowing my lawn in that part of it.

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Speaker 0: But I hate pulling weeds, and I don't don't give me a garden because

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Speaker 0: I'm like, that's I'd rather go to the

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Speaker 2: grocery store.

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Speaker 1: Can have a garden in Vancouver.

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Speaker 1: It's

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Speaker 2: it's so hard when your dad is good at something and Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Like, oh, that must have passed along to

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Speaker 0: you.

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Speaker 2: Not kidding.

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Speaker 2: No.

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Speaker 2: No.

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Speaker 2: Not so much.

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Speaker 0: I don't I don't wanna deal with gardens.

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Speaker 0: So what was your dad's job in

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Speaker 1: the family?

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Speaker 1: Like, what was his unofficial title?

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Speaker 1: You know, what was his goal?

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Speaker 0: He he was old school money went money money maker, breadwinner, whatever you

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Speaker 0: wanna say it.

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Speaker 0: Like, I had a pretty traditional my parents were pretty traditional where

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Speaker 0: even when my mom worked, she was a teacher.

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Speaker 0: My father was a salesman and an entrepreneur, but it was really about

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Speaker 0: him going out there and and doing a good job to support the family.

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Speaker 0: And my father being in sales, I'm I I'm in sales as

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Speaker 0: well.

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Speaker 0: I always remember years ago my mom saying to me, one of the most

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Speaker 0: important things of my job is, this is my mom saying this, is making

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Speaker 0: sure your father's happy because a good a happy salesman is a good

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Speaker 0: salesman.

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Speaker 0: Yeah.

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Speaker 0: And I'm like, yeah.

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Speaker 0: You're right, mom.

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Speaker 0: Like, it's about a frame of mind and a mindset.

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Speaker 0: And if you're in a good frame of mind, you're a better salesperson, and

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Speaker 0: you're able to help people find those solutions.

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Speaker 0: So yeah.

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Speaker 0: Did he

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Speaker 2: this is a presupposition, but a lot of, determined salespeople have, like, a

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Speaker 2: mantra.

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Speaker 2: They have, like, a key thing that they use over and over again.

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Speaker 0: Mhmm.

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Speaker 2: I'm borrowing a page from Roger's dad here because I know he has an

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Speaker 2: expression that he repeated over and over again, which was what was it again?

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Speaker 2: Supply and demand?

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Speaker 0: Oh, yes.

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Speaker 0: Supply and demand.

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Speaker 1: He always just say there was this thing.

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Speaker 1: Like Right.

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Speaker 1: Roger, it's all about supply and demand.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Supply and demand.

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Speaker 2: Did your dad have anything that the it's a two part question, which is,

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Speaker 2: did he have anything he said?

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Speaker 2: And is it the thing that kind of haunts you?

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Speaker 2: Can you still hear him say it?

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Speaker 0: I I don't know if it's specifically about sales, but power of positive thinking

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Speaker 0: was was his his thing.

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Speaker 0: That's great.

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Speaker 0: And,

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Speaker 0: and I don't know if he said this.

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Speaker 0: It's more of the I think it's an old,

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Speaker 0: maybe are you Rudyard Kipling poem, if it's to be, it's up to me

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Speaker 0: or something.

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Speaker 0: There's a there's a saying in there.

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Speaker 0: So it's just about, you know, being self accountable and being positive.

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Speaker 0: That's my father was very much that type of person.

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Speaker 0: So it's definitely rubbed off on me for sure.

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Speaker 2: So he's an entrepreneur.

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Speaker 2: He's a salesperson at heart.

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Speaker 2: Yep.

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Speaker 2: He's a gardener.

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Speaker 0: Cultivates.

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Speaker 2: He's a cultivator.

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Speaker 0: He's a cultivator.

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Speaker 2: Building this personality for him.

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Speaker 2: Is there, a way that his friends would have described him?

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Speaker 2: Like, if you if we were to bring in anybody that knew him, probably

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Speaker 2: different than you knew him Yeah.

00:08:10.535 --> 00:08:13.255
Speaker 2: How would they describe him?

00:08:13.255 --> 00:08:13.975
Speaker 0: Pushy?

00:08:13.975 --> 00:08:14.375
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:08:14.375 --> 00:08:15.095
Speaker 2: Great.

00:08:15.095 --> 00:08:16.375
Speaker 2: Sounds like a true friend.

00:08:16.375 --> 00:08:17.095
Speaker 2: It's a true friend.

00:08:17.095 --> 00:08:18.295
Speaker 2: And we'd like them to call in.

00:08:18.295 --> 00:08:22.295
Speaker 0: My my father was very because of who he he was just he was

00:08:22.375 --> 00:08:23.480
Speaker 0: always involved.

00:08:23.480 --> 00:08:27.480
Speaker 0: He was he was all he was he was, involved in charities,

00:08:27.720 --> 00:08:31.720
Speaker 0: and he was in Kiwanis Club, and he was the president of a of

00:08:32.200 --> 00:08:36.200
Speaker 0: a, cottages association that we we we're luck

00:08:36.200 --> 00:08:39.080
Speaker 0: I'm very grateful, very lucky to have grown up to be able to go

00:08:39.080 --> 00:08:40.815
Speaker 0: to a cottage or a cabin, shall we call it.

00:08:40.815 --> 00:08:42.655
Speaker 2: Is there an association for cottage?

00:08:42.655 --> 00:08:42.975
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:08:42.975 --> 00:08:46.575
Speaker 0: In in where we were, in Ontario where the cottage was.

00:08:46.575 --> 00:08:50.575
Speaker 0: So he became the president of that, and he's just always involved

00:08:50.575 --> 00:08:52.415
Speaker 0: in the community and giving back.

00:08:52.415 --> 00:08:55.960
Speaker 0: But because of who he is as well, he's a bit of a bit

00:08:55.960 --> 00:08:56.680
Speaker 0: of a go getter.

00:08:56.680 --> 00:09:00.040
Speaker 0: He'd be kind of in people's faces and, like, let's move this along.

00:09:00.040 --> 00:09:01.640
Speaker 0: Let's make this happen and all this stuff.

00:09:01.640 --> 00:09:05.320
Speaker 0: So he could be considered a bit pushy, but I think people would say

00:09:05.320 --> 00:09:09.080
Speaker 0: that, but they mean it in a positive positive

00:09:09.080 --> 00:09:09.575
Speaker 1: light.

00:09:09.575 --> 00:09:13.575
Speaker 1: Sounds like very, like, Napoleon Hill, Vince Norman Vincent Peele, like,

00:09:13.655 --> 00:09:14.695
Speaker 1: positive thinking.

00:09:14.695 --> 00:09:14.935
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:09:14.935 --> 00:09:15.335
Speaker 1: You know?

00:09:15.335 --> 00:09:15.815
Speaker 0: Yep.

00:09:15.815 --> 00:09:16.015
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:09:15.975 --> 00:09:16.295
Speaker 0: Did he

00:09:16.295 --> 00:09:17.335
Speaker 2: have lots of friends?

00:09:17.335 --> 00:09:17.535
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:09:17.495 --> 00:09:20.455
Speaker 2: This is a hard thing for some men as they get older to keep

00:09:20.455 --> 00:09:21.415
Speaker 2: these friend groups up.

00:09:21.415 --> 00:09:21.815
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:09:21.815 --> 00:09:24.215
Speaker 2: But he was a kind of a guy who had lots of social pursuits

00:09:24.215 --> 00:09:24.535
Speaker 2: kinda.

00:09:24.535 --> 00:09:24.800
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:09:24.800 --> 00:09:25.000
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:09:24.960 --> 00:09:27.520
Speaker 0: There was, this funeral, there was a lot of people Mhmm.

00:09:27.520 --> 00:09:30.400
Speaker 0: That were luckily were still around because he lost, you know, the you know,

00:09:30.400 --> 00:09:33.920
Speaker 0: you get older and, you know, you lose a lot of you you'd talk

00:09:33.920 --> 00:09:34.400
Speaker 0: to my dad.

00:09:34.400 --> 00:09:36.400
Speaker 0: He's like, oh, you know, so and so, they just passed away.

00:09:36.400 --> 00:09:36.975
Speaker 0: I'm sorry, dad.

00:09:36.975 --> 00:09:38.735
Speaker 0: And then so and so just passed away.

00:09:38.735 --> 00:09:42.735
Speaker 0: It happens a lot as they're luckily, he my father was eighty six.

00:09:42.815 --> 00:09:43.535
Speaker 0: Oh, wow.

00:09:43.535 --> 00:09:44.495
Speaker 0: Good long life.

00:09:44.495 --> 00:09:44.695
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:09:44.655 --> 00:09:48.015
Speaker 0: But, there were still a lot of people at his funeral as well that

00:09:48.015 --> 00:09:52.015
Speaker 0: knew him very closely, but also, not as close, but just

00:09:52.320 --> 00:09:56.080
Speaker 0: knew him through business or through his volunteer work.

00:09:56.080 --> 00:09:58.000
Speaker 0: And we're like, I'm gonna go pay respects.

00:09:58.000 --> 00:10:00.240
Speaker 1: So Did you,

00:10:00.240 --> 00:10:02.720
Speaker 2: find out anything at the funeral that you were surprised?

00:10:02.720 --> 00:10:04.880
Speaker 2: Because, again, this is a guy you knew your whole life.

00:10:04.880 --> 00:10:05.200
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:10:05.200 --> 00:10:08.165
Speaker 2: This is and I'm this happened to me a little bit too, but people

00:10:08.165 --> 00:10:09.845
Speaker 2: would come up and tell me this story Right.

00:10:09.845 --> 00:10:13.365
Speaker 2: Of my father, and I think, like, eighty years almost, I've known this guy.

00:10:13.365 --> 00:10:14.965
Speaker 2: I've never heard this story before.

00:10:14.965 --> 00:10:17.605
Speaker 2: Was there any sort of, like, insight into his character that

00:10:17.605 --> 00:10:18.565
Speaker 1: He was a juggler?

00:10:18.565 --> 00:10:18.965
Speaker 0: I don't know.

00:10:18.965 --> 00:10:21.060
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:10:21.060 --> 00:10:24.580
Speaker 2: Any character insight that got that's been shined on the light maybe, at the

00:10:24.580 --> 00:10:27.620
Speaker 2: funeral or afterwards that you learned about him?

00:10:27.620 --> 00:10:27.860
Speaker 2: That's

00:10:27.860 --> 00:10:28.980
Speaker 0: a really good question.

00:10:28.980 --> 00:10:32.260
Speaker 0: I don't top of my head, I don't think so, but I met people

00:10:32.260 --> 00:10:35.965
Speaker 0: that he talked about over the years that I'd never met before.

00:10:35.965 --> 00:10:36.165
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:10:36.045 --> 00:10:37.125
Speaker 0: So I met them at the funeral.

00:10:37.125 --> 00:10:37.965
Speaker 0: He's not wild.

00:10:37.965 --> 00:10:39.645
Speaker 0: Oh, you're that person.

00:10:39.645 --> 00:10:40.685
Speaker 0: Oh, you're that person.

00:10:40.685 --> 00:10:44.045
Speaker 0: So that well, that was kinda cool to put a a face to a

00:10:44.045 --> 00:10:48.045
Speaker 0: name of of people that were influences to him or he was an influence

00:10:48.125 --> 00:10:48.970
Speaker 0: on them.

00:10:48.970 --> 00:10:52.970
Speaker 2: It's so fascinating because their character continues after they pass,

00:10:53.210 --> 00:10:53.770
Speaker 2: I always think.

00:10:53.770 --> 00:10:57.130
Speaker 2: And so you're still I'm still learning about who my dad was.

00:10:57.130 --> 00:10:59.690
Speaker 2: You know, he died in twenty twenty one, and I'm still learning a little

00:10:59.690 --> 00:11:02.865
Speaker 2: bit like, oh, he was actually a slightly different person, and I'll meet a

00:11:02.865 --> 00:11:04.705
Speaker 2: new person sometimes that that knew him.

00:11:04.705 --> 00:11:07.665
Speaker 1: When my dad died, it was interesting because a lot of my friends came

00:11:07.665 --> 00:11:11.425
Speaker 1: out of the woodwork to tell me just how much he meant to them.

00:11:11.425 --> 00:11:12.945
Speaker 1: Like, he was like a mentor to them.

00:11:12.945 --> 00:11:13.265
Speaker 0: Oh, right.

00:11:13.265 --> 00:11:13.670
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:11:13.670 --> 00:11:14.630
Speaker 0: Although I would have had

00:11:14.630 --> 00:11:15.270
Speaker 1: no idea.

00:11:15.270 --> 00:11:18.710
Speaker 1: Like, they they didn't necessarily have dads growing up, and they didn't they didn't

00:11:18.710 --> 00:11:22.710
Speaker 1: really have, like, a, you know, a a formal mentor relationship, but they all

00:11:22.710 --> 00:11:23.990
Speaker 1: came up to me more like, yeah.

00:11:23.990 --> 00:11:27.350
Speaker 1: He anyways, it was it was really touch touching to hear that.

00:11:27.350 --> 00:11:27.910
Speaker 1: So

00:11:27.910 --> 00:11:28.470
Speaker 0: That's great.

00:11:28.470 --> 00:11:29.015
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:11:29.015 --> 00:11:29.895
Speaker 2: How Love it.

00:11:29.895 --> 00:11:30.535
Speaker 2: Did he go?

00:11:30.535 --> 00:11:31.895
Speaker 2: So it was twenty twenty two.

00:11:31.895 --> 00:11:32.695
Speaker 2: So Yes.

00:11:32.695 --> 00:11:35.095
Speaker 2: Post we're sort of out of the COVID era.

00:11:35.095 --> 00:11:35.415
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:11:35.415 --> 00:11:35.735
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:11:35.735 --> 00:11:36.135
Speaker 0: So

00:11:36.135 --> 00:11:37.255
Speaker 2: Is he in this neighborhood?

00:11:37.255 --> 00:11:37.975
Speaker 2: You said No.

00:11:37.975 --> 00:11:38.375
Speaker 0: No.

00:11:38.375 --> 00:11:39.175
Speaker 0: I grew up.

00:11:39.175 --> 00:11:40.615
Speaker 0: I'm I'm from Ontario originally.

00:11:40.615 --> 00:11:42.215
Speaker 0: I've been out here twenty five years, though.

00:11:42.215 --> 00:11:42.935
Speaker 0: Okay.

00:11:42.935 --> 00:11:46.750
Speaker 0: And they he was, in Ontario,

00:11:46.750 --> 00:11:50.750
Speaker 0: well, for for his final days, but what for many, many years, of course.

00:11:50.830 --> 00:11:52.430
Speaker 0: And,

00:11:52.430 --> 00:11:56.430
Speaker 0: yeah, it was I think it was about the summer of twenty twenty one.

00:11:56.830 --> 00:12:00.830
Speaker 0: My brother lives out and lives close by to where my parents

00:12:00.925 --> 00:12:02.445
Speaker 0: lived.

00:12:02.445 --> 00:12:06.285
Speaker 0: And and I would see my parents every summer because we'd fly back and

00:12:06.285 --> 00:12:09.805
Speaker 0: go spend time with them at the cottage and and all this stuff.

00:12:09.805 --> 00:12:11.430
Speaker 0: And,

00:12:11.430 --> 00:12:13.670
Speaker 0: he just seemed to getting older, but I'm like, okay.

00:12:13.670 --> 00:12:16.310
Speaker 0: Well, you are eighty five and all this stuff, but he seemed just a

00:12:16.310 --> 00:12:16.790
Speaker 0: bit thinner.

00:12:16.790 --> 00:12:18.070
Speaker 0: He was all he was a runner.

00:12:18.070 --> 00:12:18.270
Speaker 0: Mhmm.

00:12:18.230 --> 00:12:18.790
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:12:18.790 --> 00:12:22.790
Speaker 0: He was always very, conscious about about eating well

00:12:23.030 --> 00:12:23.910
Speaker 0: and everything like that.

00:12:23.910 --> 00:12:25.910
Speaker 0: So he was always more of a on a thin side.

00:12:25.910 --> 00:12:28.525
Speaker 2: But you see the notice because you're going away and coming back.

00:12:28.525 --> 00:12:28.845
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:12:28.845 --> 00:12:30.605
Speaker 0: So I noticed, and my brother said something.

00:12:30.605 --> 00:12:33.245
Speaker 0: He said, dad, you know, he just seems a bit, you know, thinner.

00:12:33.245 --> 00:12:33.885
Speaker 0: I'm like, okay.

00:12:33.885 --> 00:12:34.445
Speaker 0: Okay.

00:12:34.445 --> 00:12:38.445
Speaker 0: And then in the fall of twenty one, he started seeing some

00:12:38.445 --> 00:12:42.445
Speaker 0: doctors, and they're like, oh, you've got cancer.

00:12:43.850 --> 00:12:46.890
Speaker 0: And then in the fall so I started going out back and forth a

00:12:46.890 --> 00:12:47.850
Speaker 0: little bit more.

00:12:47.850 --> 00:12:51.850
Speaker 0: And it was interesting because I think

00:12:52.025 --> 00:12:55.705
Speaker 0: I I don't know if if it happens with a lot of

00:12:55.705 --> 00:12:59.145
Speaker 0: with people when when they get this news from a doctor, if they they

00:12:59.145 --> 00:13:01.545
Speaker 0: just gloss over it or not.

00:13:01.545 --> 00:13:04.025
Speaker 0: But I talked to him, and I'm like, so, dad, if you ask the

00:13:04.025 --> 00:13:08.025
Speaker 0: question, like, what what what exactly are the routines

00:13:08.110 --> 00:13:08.830
Speaker 0: you gotta go through?

00:13:08.830 --> 00:13:12.270
Speaker 0: What are the what are the the, the the things you can do to

00:13:12.270 --> 00:13:16.270
Speaker 0: either kill it or get over it or whatever, chemo, pills,

00:13:16.590 --> 00:13:17.710
Speaker 0: this, whatever it is.

00:13:17.710 --> 00:13:18.110
Speaker 0: Mhmm.

00:13:18.110 --> 00:13:19.230
Speaker 0: Oh, well, blah, blah, blah.

00:13:19.230 --> 00:13:21.585
Speaker 0: And I'm like, but you haven't asked detailed questions.

00:13:21.585 --> 00:13:23.425
Speaker 0: You're giving me just vague answers.

00:13:23.425 --> 00:13:23.745
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:13:23.745 --> 00:13:26.785
Speaker 0: So I ended up flying back a number of times and going with my

00:13:26.785 --> 00:13:29.185
Speaker 0: dad to the doctor's appointments.

00:13:29.185 --> 00:13:29.985
Speaker 0: You advocated.

00:13:29.985 --> 00:13:33.985
Speaker 0: And and and literally was in one of them and and asked a question.

00:13:34.910 --> 00:13:38.350
Speaker 0: So if he does this, how long what's the probability of success in life?

00:13:38.350 --> 00:13:38.590
Speaker 0: Right.

00:13:38.590 --> 00:13:40.430
Speaker 0: If he does this, what's the probability?

00:13:40.430 --> 00:13:41.150
Speaker 0: What's this?

00:13:41.150 --> 00:13:45.150
Speaker 0: And we came out of there with definitive answers, and he had a shocked

00:13:45.230 --> 00:13:45.950
Speaker 0: look on his face.

00:13:45.950 --> 00:13:49.950
Speaker 0: And I realized that he hadn't really asked those detailed questions Yeah.

00:13:50.105 --> 00:13:51.705
Speaker 0: Where I think it was by now.

00:13:51.705 --> 00:13:54.665
Speaker 0: It was, like, end of November.

00:13:54.665 --> 00:13:58.665
Speaker 0: And they're pretty much if you do chemo, you probably got six months.

00:13:58.745 --> 00:14:01.590
Speaker 0: If you don't do chemo, you probably got three.

00:14:01.590 --> 00:14:02.550
Speaker 0: And I was like, okay.

00:14:02.550 --> 00:14:04.310
Speaker 0: Well, dad, this is this is where we are.

00:14:04.310 --> 00:14:08.310
Speaker 0: And then, of course, like, if you do chemo and you get

00:14:08.390 --> 00:14:12.390
Speaker 0: six months, I mean, that's the the there's that one to three percent chance

00:14:12.710 --> 00:14:13.590
Speaker 0: you might survive.

00:14:13.590 --> 00:14:13.895
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:14:13.895 --> 00:14:15.415
Speaker 1: And it's not a fun six months.

00:14:15.415 --> 00:14:16.455
Speaker 0: You know, exactly.

00:14:16.455 --> 00:14:16.855
Speaker 0: Difficult.

00:14:16.855 --> 00:14:17.335
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:14:17.335 --> 00:14:17.535
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:14:17.495 --> 00:14:19.015
Speaker 0: So he ended up going, okay.

00:14:19.015 --> 00:14:20.055
Speaker 0: Well, I'm gonna do chemo.

00:14:20.055 --> 00:14:24.055
Speaker 0: I'd like to spend one more summer at the cottage, which is kind

00:14:24.215 --> 00:14:28.050
Speaker 0: of our family home, shall we say, because it my parents got it back

00:14:28.050 --> 00:14:29.490
Speaker 0: in the late oh, sorry.

00:14:29.490 --> 00:14:30.370
Speaker 0: Mid sixties.

00:14:30.370 --> 00:14:30.690
Speaker 0: Wow.

00:14:30.690 --> 00:14:33.330
Speaker 0: So I grew up lucky enough to go there as a kid.

00:14:33.330 --> 00:14:34.530
Speaker 0: My parents loved it there.

00:14:34.530 --> 00:14:37.490
Speaker 0: They kinda retired to there, stuff like that.

00:14:37.490 --> 00:14:40.290
Speaker 0: And they've got lots of friends in the community there as well.

00:14:40.290 --> 00:14:43.065
Speaker 0: But, when,

00:14:43.065 --> 00:14:44.425
Speaker 0: when he was told this, he's like, okay.

00:14:44.425 --> 00:14:45.785
Speaker 0: I'm gonna do chemo.

00:14:45.785 --> 00:14:46.825
Speaker 0: And we're like, okay.

00:14:46.825 --> 00:14:47.065
Speaker 0: Great.

00:14:47.065 --> 00:14:48.105
Speaker 0: Let let's do that.

00:14:48.105 --> 00:14:52.105
Speaker 0: And and then, dad, I gotta fly back to to back home,

00:14:52.265 --> 00:14:54.425
Speaker 0: see my family, but I'll be back out for Christmas.

00:14:54.425 --> 00:14:55.625
Speaker 0: We'll spend Christmas together.

00:14:55.625 --> 00:14:57.090
Speaker 0: We'll bring the whole family out.

00:14:57.090 --> 00:15:00.850
Speaker 0: And then at about two weeks later or after two or three weeks into

00:15:00.850 --> 00:15:03.090
Speaker 0: the chemo, he's just like, I can't do this.

00:15:03.090 --> 00:15:05.010
Speaker 0: This is, like, just destroying me.

00:15:05.010 --> 00:15:05.490
Speaker 0: Right.

00:15:05.490 --> 00:15:08.770
Speaker 0: And he's like, I think I realized that this is this is it.

00:15:08.770 --> 00:15:12.695
Speaker 0: So, you know, I don't know how long I'm gonna survive and all this

00:15:12.695 --> 00:15:15.895
Speaker 0: stuff, but I'm not gonna do chemo, and I'm just gonna spend my final

00:15:15.895 --> 00:15:17.495
Speaker 0: days doing the most I can.

00:15:17.495 --> 00:15:20.375
Speaker 0: And so I just flew back and forth back and forth to see him

00:15:20.375 --> 00:15:21.895
Speaker 0: as much as possible.

00:15:21.895 --> 00:15:22.215
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:15:22.215 --> 00:15:26.215
Speaker 2: You said something which actually I think is more common, which is,

00:15:27.730 --> 00:15:31.730
Speaker 2: the scenario where the person that's dying has been presented with

00:15:31.810 --> 00:15:32.770
Speaker 2: this information

00:15:32.770 --> 00:15:33.090
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:15:33.090 --> 00:15:34.850
Speaker 2: And then has to inform their children

00:15:34.850 --> 00:15:35.410
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:15:35.410 --> 00:15:37.090
Speaker 2: And doesn't have enough information.

00:15:37.090 --> 00:15:37.290
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:15:37.250 --> 00:15:39.170
Speaker 2: And the children are incredibly frustrated.

00:15:39.170 --> 00:15:39.855
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:15:39.855 --> 00:15:41.455
Speaker 2: Because, it's pure.

00:15:41.455 --> 00:15:42.175
Speaker 2: It's clean.

00:15:42.175 --> 00:15:43.695
Speaker 2: You've been given a diagnosis.

00:15:43.695 --> 00:15:43.895
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:15:43.855 --> 00:15:46.095
Speaker 2: Like, why can't you remember this information?

00:15:46.095 --> 00:15:48.095
Speaker 2: And I think it's very common.

00:15:48.095 --> 00:15:52.010
Speaker 2: And then I think to myself, imagine being like again, you mentioned this.

00:15:52.010 --> 00:15:54.490
Speaker 2: At their age, everybody they know is getting sick

00:15:54.490 --> 00:15:54.730
Speaker 0: Right.

00:15:54.730 --> 00:15:54.930
Speaker 0: And

00:15:54.890 --> 00:15:55.370
Speaker 2: dying.

00:15:55.370 --> 00:15:59.290
Speaker 2: And so they're hearing the prognosis that they know

00:15:59.290 --> 00:15:59.690
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:15:59.690 --> 00:16:00.810
Speaker 2: Of their friends have had.

00:16:00.810 --> 00:16:01.130
Speaker 2: Right?

00:16:01.130 --> 00:16:01.770
Speaker 2: And so

00:16:01.770 --> 00:16:05.130
Speaker 1: And they're also, you know, runners, and they have a healthy lifestyle.

00:16:05.130 --> 00:16:05.330
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:16:05.290 --> 00:16:07.785
Speaker 1: And it's like the kid's on me, and I'll be fine.

00:16:07.785 --> 00:16:08.745
Speaker 1: And Right.

00:16:08.745 --> 00:16:12.185
Speaker 1: You know, also, you know, not wanting to worry you and the family and

00:16:12.185 --> 00:16:12.985
Speaker 1: grandkids.

00:16:12.985 --> 00:16:13.305
Speaker 2: Yep.

00:16:13.305 --> 00:16:14.745
Speaker 2: I used to get them to record it.

00:16:14.745 --> 00:16:17.065
Speaker 2: That's what I used to do because I would be able what?

00:16:17.065 --> 00:16:18.025
Speaker 2: Their doctor's visits.

00:16:18.025 --> 00:16:18.225
Speaker 0: Oh,

00:16:18.185 --> 00:16:18.425
Speaker 2: okay.

00:16:18.425 --> 00:16:20.345
Speaker 2: I would get them to just turn on their phone and

00:16:20.345 --> 00:16:20.545
Speaker 0: get

00:16:20.505 --> 00:16:22.960
Speaker 2: them to just leave it in the middle and say, you know

00:16:22.960 --> 00:16:23.280
Speaker 0: Yes.

00:16:23.280 --> 00:16:24.400
Speaker 2: Make sure that the doctor knows.

00:16:24.400 --> 00:16:26.160
Speaker 1: Can't imagine my dad knowing how to turn on

00:16:26.160 --> 00:16:26.800
Speaker 2: his phone.

00:16:26.800 --> 00:16:27.120
Speaker 0: That was

00:16:27.120 --> 00:16:28.000
Speaker 2: my And there was

00:16:28.000 --> 00:16:29.920
Speaker 0: no comedy because he was call people?

00:16:29.920 --> 00:16:30.240
Speaker 0: Is that

00:16:30.240 --> 00:16:31.200
Speaker 2: what a phone is for?

00:16:31.200 --> 00:16:31.840
Speaker 0: You call people?

00:16:31.840 --> 00:16:32.080
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:16:32.080 --> 00:16:32.320
Speaker 2: Exactly.

00:16:32.320 --> 00:16:35.155
Speaker 0: Or if you get stuck in your car and you need to call, you

00:16:35.155 --> 00:16:37.755
Speaker 2: know We could do a whole segment on FaceTiming your parents.

00:16:37.755 --> 00:16:37.995
Speaker 0: Yes.

00:16:37.995 --> 00:16:38.955
Speaker 0: Exactly.

00:16:38.955 --> 00:16:42.955
Speaker 2: But it was incredibly it was a gift because I think the pressure to

00:16:42.955 --> 00:16:46.955
Speaker 2: deal with the realization of of the prognosis and also to try to capture

00:16:47.195 --> 00:16:48.730
Speaker 2: the scientific information

00:16:48.730 --> 00:16:49.050
Speaker 0: Right.

00:16:49.050 --> 00:16:50.170
Speaker 2: Seems like a bit difficult.

00:16:50.170 --> 00:16:53.290
Speaker 2: And I'm I'm sure your dad did as best as he could, but also

00:16:53.290 --> 00:16:55.130
Speaker 2: great that you were able to come out there and Yeah.

00:16:55.130 --> 00:16:56.250
Speaker 2: And advocate for him.

00:16:56.250 --> 00:16:56.570
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:16:56.570 --> 00:16:58.010
Speaker 1: So when Go ahead.

00:16:58.010 --> 00:16:59.770
Speaker 1: When he when he told you that

00:16:59.770 --> 00:17:01.385
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:17:01.385 --> 00:17:04.265
Speaker 0: What was your reaction?

00:17:04.265 --> 00:17:06.345
Speaker 0: I think my first reaction was like, okay.

00:17:06.345 --> 00:17:09.545
Speaker 0: That makes sense as to why he's even thinner than he normally is.

00:17:09.545 --> 00:17:12.105
Speaker 0: Right.

00:17:12.105 --> 00:17:13.225
Speaker 0: Were you alone?

00:17:13.225 --> 00:17:13.425
Speaker 0: But but

00:17:13.385 --> 00:17:16.185
Speaker 2: when he told you are you wondering when he told you that he was

00:17:16.185 --> 00:17:16.985
Speaker 2: gonna stop chemo?

00:17:16.985 --> 00:17:17.680
Speaker 2: Because he was gonna

00:17:17.680 --> 00:17:20.240
Speaker 0: stop the stopping chemo or when he first found out he had cancer.

00:17:20.240 --> 00:17:21.520
Speaker 1: When he first found out he had

00:17:21.520 --> 00:17:21.720
Speaker 0: cancer.

00:17:21.680 --> 00:17:21.880
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:17:21.840 --> 00:17:22.640
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:17:22.640 --> 00:17:26.640
Speaker 0: I can't remember exactly where I was or how he he

00:17:26.800 --> 00:17:30.800
Speaker 0: probably told me on the phone because, yeah, I was out here.

00:17:31.440 --> 00:17:35.165
Speaker 0: I I think my first reaction was, okay.

00:17:35.165 --> 00:17:36.125
Speaker 0: What are we gonna do?

00:17:36.125 --> 00:17:37.005
Speaker 0: Like, what Yeah.

00:17:37.005 --> 00:17:39.245
Speaker 0: What I and that's kind of who he is too.

00:17:39.245 --> 00:17:40.045
Speaker 0: He's like, okay.

00:17:40.045 --> 00:17:41.005
Speaker 0: You've got a problem.

00:17:41.005 --> 00:17:41.885
Speaker 0: Let's find a solution.

00:17:41.885 --> 00:17:42.205
Speaker 0: Totally.

00:17:42.205 --> 00:17:42.765
Speaker 0: You got a problem?

00:17:42.765 --> 00:17:43.885
Speaker 0: How are we gonna work through this?

00:17:43.885 --> 00:17:45.180
Speaker 0: You got a problem?

00:17:45.180 --> 00:17:46.140
Speaker 0: Who's gonna help you?

00:17:46.140 --> 00:17:47.980
Speaker 0: How what do you have to do to help yourself?

00:17:47.980 --> 00:17:49.340
Speaker 0: Who's gonna provide support?

00:17:49.340 --> 00:17:49.820
Speaker 0: Stuff like that.

00:17:49.820 --> 00:17:50.380
Speaker 0: What do we know?

00:17:50.380 --> 00:17:51.340
Speaker 0: What do we not know?

00:17:51.340 --> 00:17:51.820
Speaker 0: Exactly.

00:17:51.820 --> 00:17:54.300
Speaker 0: So I think that was what was going through my mind, and it was

00:17:54.300 --> 00:17:55.100
Speaker 0: just, okay.

00:17:55.100 --> 00:17:58.140
Speaker 0: I've got a a family with young kids.

00:17:58.140 --> 00:18:00.060
Speaker 0: I have responsibilities here.

00:18:00.060 --> 00:18:04.060
Speaker 0: How do I make sure I can go see him, and work with

00:18:04.115 --> 00:18:07.555
Speaker 0: my brother who's in the same community, but just also make sure and then

00:18:07.555 --> 00:18:08.435
Speaker 0: support mom as well.

00:18:08.435 --> 00:18:08.675
Speaker 0: Mhmm.

00:18:08.675 --> 00:18:12.355
Speaker 0: So it's just all those different things about, well, what do I do and

00:18:12.355 --> 00:18:15.940
Speaker 0: how do we, you know, get involved and

00:18:15.940 --> 00:18:18.500
Speaker 1: You get into kinda logistics mode while also

00:18:18.500 --> 00:18:20.500
Speaker 0: robotic in a way.

00:18:20.500 --> 00:18:20.820
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:18:20.820 --> 00:18:22.820
Speaker 1: But also shocked, I'm assuming.

00:18:22.820 --> 00:18:23.140
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:18:23.140 --> 00:18:23.540
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:18:23.540 --> 00:18:24.660
Speaker 1: Because it's your dad.

00:18:24.660 --> 00:18:28.095
Speaker 1: And you also have to be there for your family and there for your

00:18:28.095 --> 00:18:29.535
Speaker 1: mom, and it's it's a lot.

00:18:29.535 --> 00:18:30.095
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:18:30.095 --> 00:18:32.335
Speaker 2: What did you tell your kids?

00:18:32.335 --> 00:18:35.375
Speaker 2: Or did you tell your kids?

00:18:35.375 --> 00:18:36.335
Speaker 2: Because they would've been

00:18:36.335 --> 00:18:36.655
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:18:36.655 --> 00:18:36.895
Speaker 0: Three or

00:18:36.895 --> 00:18:37.935
Speaker 2: four years ago, so doing

00:18:37.935 --> 00:18:38.415
Speaker 0: them Yeah.

00:18:38.415 --> 00:18:38.975
Speaker 2: Three years ago.

00:18:38.975 --> 00:18:39.720
Speaker 2: So No.

00:18:39.720 --> 00:18:40.920
Speaker 2: They're in they're just teens.

00:18:40.920 --> 00:18:41.120
Speaker 0: Right?

00:18:41.080 --> 00:18:41.720
Speaker 0: They're just teens.

00:18:41.720 --> 00:18:42.200
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:18:42.200 --> 00:18:42.680
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:18:42.680 --> 00:18:46.680
Speaker 0: So so my my daughter would have been nine and my son probably about

00:18:46.840 --> 00:18:49.480
Speaker 0: eleven at the time.

00:18:49.480 --> 00:18:53.480
Speaker 0: I think we told him that that papa, as they've

00:18:53.485 --> 00:18:57.485
Speaker 0: called him, had cancer, and he's not well.

00:18:57.965 --> 00:19:01.965
Speaker 0: And, but, you know, at that age, nine eleven, they're like, okay.

00:19:02.045 --> 00:19:02.845
Speaker 0: Someone's sick.

00:19:02.845 --> 00:19:04.125
Speaker 0: So when are they gonna get better?

00:19:04.125 --> 00:19:04.365
Speaker 0: Right.

00:19:04.365 --> 00:19:08.365
Speaker 0: And I don't think they realized it until pretty much when it

00:19:08.520 --> 00:19:12.520
Speaker 0: happened because even though we went Chris because it was February when he passed.

00:19:12.760 --> 00:19:13.880
Speaker 0: So we're there for Christmas.

00:19:13.880 --> 00:19:16.920
Speaker 0: So he was still we spent time with them and everything like that.

00:19:16.920 --> 00:19:19.240
Speaker 0: And then,

00:19:19.240 --> 00:19:22.245
Speaker 0: but but I think they realized that they may or may not see him

00:19:22.245 --> 00:19:25.045
Speaker 0: again, but then they came out to see him in his final days.

00:19:25.045 --> 00:19:25.285
Speaker 0: Mhmm.

00:19:25.285 --> 00:19:25.765
Speaker 0: So

00:19:25.765 --> 00:19:28.725
Speaker 2: I only ask because I think it's you know you're gonna be around your

00:19:28.725 --> 00:19:30.165
Speaker 2: kids and all this stuff's gonna happen.

00:19:30.165 --> 00:19:31.760
Speaker 2: And then when do you Yeah.

00:19:31.760 --> 00:19:32.640
Speaker 2: Start to inform them?

00:19:32.640 --> 00:19:33.680
Speaker 2: How do you keep them engaged?

00:19:33.680 --> 00:19:35.360
Speaker 2: How do you give them time, I guess, is

00:19:35.360 --> 00:19:35.560
Speaker 0: the

00:19:35.520 --> 00:19:36.880
Speaker 2: question that I'm wondering.

00:19:36.880 --> 00:19:40.480
Speaker 1: And in those final days, where where was he?

00:19:40.480 --> 00:19:41.520
Speaker 1: Who was around?

00:19:41.520 --> 00:19:44.515
Speaker 1: What was the what was that like?

00:19:44.515 --> 00:19:48.515
Speaker 0: Oh, his final day he was in hospice in Collingwood, Ontario.

00:19:48.515 --> 00:19:52.515
Speaker 0: And, so we were able luckily, able to get him into that one

00:19:53.075 --> 00:19:54.355
Speaker 0: into one.

00:19:54.355 --> 00:19:57.030
Speaker 1: So he said I'm I'm gonna stop chemo.

00:19:57.030 --> 00:19:59.670
Speaker 0: That was about, middle of December.

00:19:59.670 --> 00:20:01.910
Speaker 0: First week of December, he said I'm stopping chemo.

00:20:01.910 --> 00:20:02.390
Speaker 0: Right.

00:20:02.390 --> 00:20:02.950
Speaker 0: Okay.

00:20:02.950 --> 00:20:06.950
Speaker 0: And, and then we'd already planned to come out for Christmas to see

00:20:07.030 --> 00:20:09.270
Speaker 0: him and my mom and my brother.

00:20:09.270 --> 00:20:13.270
Speaker 0: And and then we were there for, like,

00:20:13.605 --> 00:20:16.805
Speaker 0: ten days or something like that, and we spent every day together.

00:20:16.805 --> 00:20:20.805
Speaker 0: And and, and then everyone went

00:20:20.885 --> 00:20:21.205
Speaker 0: home.

00:20:21.205 --> 00:20:25.205
Speaker 0: And then I think it was probably, early

00:20:25.300 --> 00:20:29.300
Speaker 0: January when then he was able to get a bed at the hospice, and

00:20:29.300 --> 00:20:30.820
Speaker 0: he was still moving fine.

00:20:30.820 --> 00:20:34.820
Speaker 0: Like, right up to his last days, his his brain was totally amazing

00:20:34.900 --> 00:20:35.700
Speaker 0: and Yeah.

00:20:35.700 --> 00:20:39.165
Speaker 0: His wits about him and everything was just his body shutting down.

00:20:39.165 --> 00:20:39.565
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:20:39.565 --> 00:20:39.965
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:20:39.965 --> 00:20:43.965
Speaker 0: But we were we were all there in in the room the

00:20:44.125 --> 00:20:47.325
Speaker 0: day like, a few hours before he passed.

00:20:47.325 --> 00:20:49.725
Speaker 0: And then

00:20:49.725 --> 00:20:50.205
Speaker 0: Sorry.

00:20:50.205 --> 00:20:50.445
Speaker 1: No.

00:20:50.445 --> 00:20:52.320
Speaker 1: It's alright.

00:20:52.320 --> 00:20:56.320
Speaker 0: And just what Mhmm.

00:20:57.520 --> 00:20:59.440
Speaker 0: And then that day Water them if you want.

00:20:59.440 --> 00:21:00.000
Speaker 0: Thank you.

00:21:00.000 --> 00:21:01.760
Speaker 0: And then and then we were there.

00:21:01.760 --> 00:21:05.760
Speaker 0: We saw him for a number of days in a row.

00:21:06.725 --> 00:21:09.125
Speaker 0: And then he just like, he could just see.

00:21:09.125 --> 00:21:10.725
Speaker 0: He he was like, I'm ready to go.

00:21:10.725 --> 00:21:11.445
Speaker 0: I'm ready to go.

00:21:11.445 --> 00:21:13.125
Speaker 0: He'd say that over, you know, number of times.

00:21:13.125 --> 00:21:15.845
Speaker 0: We'd always talk about stories, everything like that.

00:21:15.845 --> 00:21:19.845
Speaker 0: And then there was that day where he just said to the nurses,

00:21:19.880 --> 00:21:21.080
Speaker 0: I think today's the day.

00:21:21.080 --> 00:21:25.080
Speaker 0: Now and, I think he was he was so weak and everything like

00:21:25.080 --> 00:21:25.320
Speaker 0: that.

00:21:25.320 --> 00:21:27.880
Speaker 0: He didn't have get MAID.

00:21:27.880 --> 00:21:28.280
Speaker 0: Mhmm.

00:21:28.280 --> 00:21:32.280
Speaker 0: But he they basically the the nurses, like, you know, he doesn't need

00:21:32.325 --> 00:21:32.565
Speaker 0: MAID.

00:21:32.565 --> 00:21:35.685
Speaker 0: We can just give him some extra morphine tonight, and he won't wake up.

00:21:35.685 --> 00:21:36.165
Speaker 0: Right.

00:21:36.165 --> 00:21:39.605
Speaker 0: And so we we all knew that we're saying goodbye to him right then

00:21:39.605 --> 00:21:40.325
Speaker 0: and there.

00:21:40.325 --> 00:21:44.245
Speaker 0: And we went back to the house where my mom lives, where I used

00:21:44.245 --> 00:21:46.670
Speaker 0: to live, and

00:21:46.670 --> 00:21:49.790
Speaker 0: just had dinner, and then we got a phone call about nine thirty that

00:21:49.790 --> 00:21:52.750
Speaker 0: night from the hospice to say he passed.

00:21:52.750 --> 00:21:54.030
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:21:54.030 --> 00:21:54.510
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:21:54.510 --> 00:21:54.710
Speaker 0: It's

00:21:54.670 --> 00:21:57.550
Speaker 2: such a weird time to go back to the home Yeah.

00:21:57.550 --> 00:21:58.270
Speaker 2: Afterwards.

00:21:58.270 --> 00:22:00.670
Speaker 2: I found that, like I don't know what your experience was like.

00:22:00.670 --> 00:22:02.863
Speaker 2: Like, you go into that house and it's different.

00:22:02.863 --> 00:22:03.073
Speaker 2: Mhmm.

00:22:03.073 --> 00:22:03.492
Speaker 0: And then

00:22:03.492 --> 00:22:06.639
Speaker 2: you're just like, well, what what is the thing what are we supposed to

00:22:06.639 --> 00:22:06.849
Speaker 2: do?

00:22:06.849 --> 00:22:07.688
Speaker 2: What's the yeah.

00:22:07.688 --> 00:22:08.317
Speaker 0: What's the

00:22:08.317 --> 00:22:09.576
Speaker 2: what activity do you think?

00:22:09.576 --> 00:22:09.785
Speaker 0: Protocol?

00:22:09.785 --> 00:22:09.995
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:22:09.995 --> 00:22:10.834
Speaker 2: Did you guys sit?

00:22:10.834 --> 00:22:12.722
Speaker 2: Did you We we share stories?

00:22:12.722 --> 00:22:14.880
Speaker 2: What did you do when you got home?

00:22:14.880 --> 00:22:15.120
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:22:15.120 --> 00:22:15.600
Speaker 0: We did.

00:22:15.600 --> 00:22:18.080
Speaker 0: We shared stories, but we got dinner ready.

00:22:18.080 --> 00:22:21.920
Speaker 0: And, like, it's on the the my son's birthday day.

00:22:21.920 --> 00:22:22.240
Speaker 0: Oh.

00:22:22.240 --> 00:22:22.640
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:22:22.640 --> 00:22:23.120
Speaker 1: Wow.

00:22:23.120 --> 00:22:25.680
Speaker 1: So his his dad died on his sister's birthday.

00:22:25.680 --> 00:22:26.000
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:22:26.000 --> 00:22:29.725
Speaker 0: So so we're basically going back to have birthday dinner for my son.

00:22:29.725 --> 00:22:30.205
Speaker 0: Oh.

00:22:30.205 --> 00:22:34.045
Speaker 0: And but we knew it was all happening, but we're kind of hoping, even

00:22:34.045 --> 00:22:37.805
Speaker 0: though they gave him the extra morphine, we're thinking, could it maybe happen at

00:22:37.805 --> 00:22:38.525
Speaker 0: twelve o one?

00:22:38.525 --> 00:22:39.405
Speaker 2: Could you just pause it

00:22:39.405 --> 00:22:40.365
Speaker 0: and take it to pause it.

00:22:40.365 --> 00:22:40.765
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:22:40.765 --> 00:22:43.810
Speaker 0: And literally, my wife looked at me and I said, well, you know, maybe

00:22:43.810 --> 00:22:45.810
Speaker 0: that that's what might happen, but it might not.

00:22:45.810 --> 00:22:48.210
Speaker 0: And then when we got the call about nine thirty, I think my kids

00:22:48.210 --> 00:22:50.050
Speaker 0: have maybe gone to bed by then anyway.

00:22:50.050 --> 00:22:50.850
Speaker 0: But we got the call.

00:22:50.850 --> 00:22:53.250
Speaker 0: I'm like, oh, well, it is actually on his birthday.

00:22:53.250 --> 00:22:54.050
Speaker 0: So whatever.

00:22:54.050 --> 00:22:54.530
Speaker 0: Eastern?

00:22:54.530 --> 00:22:57.410
Speaker 0: I know I was doing the Yeah.

00:22:57.410 --> 00:22:58.535
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:22:58.535 --> 00:23:02.375
Speaker 2: So then you're tasked with you're in the house, and you're obviously in Ontario.

00:23:02.375 --> 00:23:06.215
Speaker 2: Did you were you the one who had to start to do the paperwork?

00:23:06.215 --> 00:23:07.175
Speaker 2: Was there other people?

00:23:07.175 --> 00:23:07.735
Speaker 0: Because Yeah.

00:23:07.735 --> 00:23:09.655
Speaker 2: It's such a weird process, which is like, okay.

00:23:09.655 --> 00:23:11.620
Speaker 2: That's over, and then there's this work Right.

00:23:11.620 --> 00:23:12.340
Speaker 2: That pops up.

00:23:12.340 --> 00:23:12.580
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:23:12.580 --> 00:23:12.820
Speaker 0: No.

00:23:12.820 --> 00:23:15.860
Speaker 0: I I did most of that because, one, I think my mom was a

00:23:15.860 --> 00:23:18.420
Speaker 0: bit I mean, she was she was helpful, but I took it on.

00:23:18.420 --> 00:23:22.020
Speaker 0: I no disrespect to my brother, but it's more my forte to deal with

00:23:22.020 --> 00:23:24.625
Speaker 0: paperwork and stuff like that than his.

00:23:24.625 --> 00:23:28.545
Speaker 0: So I was the one driving a lot of that to to happen, but,

00:23:28.545 --> 00:23:32.465
Speaker 0: yeah, you don't realize all the different things you gotta do and Right.

00:23:32.465 --> 00:23:35.585
Speaker 0: And you gotta communicate with and the lawyers and the and the That's

00:23:35.585 --> 00:23:35.905
Speaker 2: a law.

00:23:35.905 --> 00:23:38.785
Speaker 0: Funeral home and and the government and all this stuff.

00:23:38.785 --> 00:23:39.260
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:23:39.260 --> 00:23:42.620
Speaker 1: And in in the moment when it happened, you, you know, you've got all

00:23:42.620 --> 00:23:44.380
Speaker 1: this family around you and your mom.

00:23:44.380 --> 00:23:45.020
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:23:45.020 --> 00:23:48.140
Speaker 1: It sounds like you're the your your job in the family is you you

00:23:48.140 --> 00:23:51.100
Speaker 1: got you you got your shit together.

00:23:51.100 --> 00:23:51.740
Speaker 2: Glued?

00:23:51.740 --> 00:23:52.540
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:23:52.540 --> 00:23:53.180
Speaker 1: I'm curious.

00:23:53.180 --> 00:23:54.855
Speaker 1: Did you feel this

00:23:54.855 --> 00:23:58.855
Speaker 0: pressure to hold it all together?

00:23:59.015 --> 00:23:59.255
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:23:59.255 --> 00:24:00.535
Speaker 0: I I believe I did.

00:24:00.535 --> 00:24:00.775
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:24:00.775 --> 00:24:03.415
Speaker 0: I I can't deny that.

00:24:03.415 --> 00:24:06.535
Speaker 0: I can be very stoical, so I just thought, you know, it's just it

00:24:06.535 --> 00:24:07.255
Speaker 0: is what it is.

00:24:07.255 --> 00:24:11.255
Speaker 0: And we but but you you know with with death, you you're

00:24:11.300 --> 00:24:13.940
Speaker 0: you're gonna grieve, and it's gonna hit you at weird times.

00:24:13.940 --> 00:24:15.540
Speaker 0: And But we don't know.

00:24:15.540 --> 00:24:16.100
Speaker 0: Well yeah.

00:24:16.100 --> 00:24:16.740
Speaker 0: Sorry.

00:24:16.740 --> 00:24:17.380
Speaker 0: You don't know.

00:24:17.380 --> 00:24:18.980
Speaker 0: But, yeah, you just deal with it.

00:24:18.980 --> 00:24:19.180
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:24:19.140 --> 00:24:19.860
Speaker 0: I think that's it.

00:24:19.860 --> 00:24:20.995
Speaker 0: You just kinda deal with it.

00:24:20.995 --> 00:24:22.035
Speaker 0: Right?

00:24:22.035 --> 00:24:22.595
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:24:22.595 --> 00:24:26.595
Speaker 2: I'm interested in this because I think not to put your situation in mind,

00:24:26.755 --> 00:24:30.515
Speaker 2: the processing and the grief kinds to put on a shelf a little bit

00:24:30.515 --> 00:24:31.955
Speaker 2: while you get into the paperwork.

00:24:31.955 --> 00:24:32.155
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:24:32.115 --> 00:24:34.755
Speaker 2: And there is a certain amount of workload that you can kind of distract

00:24:34.755 --> 00:24:38.750
Speaker 2: yourself with where you're eliminating all these things and closing up all these loose

00:24:38.750 --> 00:24:39.870
Speaker 2: ends.

00:24:39.870 --> 00:24:40.430
Speaker 2: Was there a

00:24:40.430 --> 00:24:41.310
Speaker 0: Checking things off.

00:24:41.310 --> 00:24:41.710
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:24:41.710 --> 00:24:42.270
Speaker 0: I can talk.

00:24:42.270 --> 00:24:42.830
Speaker 0: That one's done.

00:24:42.830 --> 00:24:43.030
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:24:42.950 --> 00:24:44.110
Speaker 0: We got to put board out.

00:24:44.110 --> 00:24:44.430
Speaker 0: Yes.

00:24:44.430 --> 00:24:44.830
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:24:44.830 --> 00:24:45.030
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:24:44.990 --> 00:24:45.790
Speaker 2: This is all good.

00:24:45.790 --> 00:24:46.270
Speaker 2: This is done.

00:24:46.270 --> 00:24:48.350
Speaker 1: What's the status on the on the cell phone bill?

00:24:48.350 --> 00:24:48.670
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:24:48.670 --> 00:24:49.390
Speaker 2: Have we cleared that?

00:24:49.390 --> 00:24:49.630
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:24:49.630 --> 00:24:50.110
Speaker 0: Exactly.

00:24:50.110 --> 00:24:50.430
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:24:50.430 --> 00:24:54.430
Speaker 2: Was there a process or was there a time when you you

00:24:54.545 --> 00:24:58.225
Speaker 2: started to realize that that checklist was starting to become shorter?

00:24:58.225 --> 00:24:59.345
Speaker 2: You're starting to think, okay.

00:24:59.345 --> 00:25:03.345
Speaker 2: I'm I'm actually getting through this checklist, and now this the the rest

00:25:03.425 --> 00:25:05.185
Speaker 2: of time is starting to stretch out.

00:25:05.185 --> 00:25:09.185
Speaker 2: And were you aware of any difference in yourself as that started

00:25:09.220 --> 00:25:11.300
Speaker 2: to happen?

00:25:11.300 --> 00:25:15.140
Speaker 0: Well, I think the check like, I think, initially, you think that checklist is

00:25:15.140 --> 00:25:17.860
Speaker 0: something you're gonna check off in a few weeks, then you realize, oh my

00:25:17.860 --> 00:25:18.135
Speaker 0: god.

00:25:18.135 --> 00:25:20.855
Speaker 0: This is like a one to two to three year process Yeah.

00:25:20.855 --> 00:25:24.295
Speaker 0: When someone passes between all the all the stuff that happened.

00:25:24.295 --> 00:25:26.455
Speaker 1: Just proving that they're actually dead

00:25:26.455 --> 00:25:26.775
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:25:26.775 --> 00:25:28.215
Speaker 1: Is just a lot of work.

00:25:28.215 --> 00:25:28.935
Speaker 0: Exactly.

00:25:28.935 --> 00:25:29.415
Speaker 0: I have that

00:25:29.415 --> 00:25:30.295
Speaker 2: certificate of death.

00:25:30.295 --> 00:25:30.495
Speaker 2: How

00:25:30.375 --> 00:25:31.255
Speaker 0: many copies of Oh,

00:25:31.255 --> 00:25:31.575
Speaker 1: I know.

00:25:31.575 --> 00:25:32.215
Speaker 0: They've been dead.

00:25:32.215 --> 00:25:32.775
Speaker 0: Do I have?

00:25:32.775 --> 00:25:36.775
Speaker 0: And was I mailing out to people

00:25:37.470 --> 00:25:38.510
Speaker 0: and organizations.

00:25:38.510 --> 00:25:38.910
Speaker 0: And each

00:25:38.910 --> 00:25:42.910
Speaker 1: organization has a different rule for submitting it and what

00:25:43.230 --> 00:25:44.590
Speaker 1: like, there should be a Yeah.

00:25:44.590 --> 00:25:46.510
Speaker 1: A a anyway, there should be a law where it's

00:25:46.510 --> 00:25:47.285
Speaker 0: just all the same.

00:25:47.285 --> 00:25:47.605
Speaker 2: I know.

00:25:47.605 --> 00:25:48.085
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:25:48.085 --> 00:25:49.685
Speaker 2: So he he's in the jelly of the month club?

00:25:49.685 --> 00:25:49.885
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:25:49.845 --> 00:25:51.365
Speaker 2: We're gonna need to see a certificate of that.

00:25:51.365 --> 00:25:51.565
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:25:51.525 --> 00:25:51.925
Speaker 0: Exactly.

00:25:51.925 --> 00:25:52.125
Speaker 0: We're

00:25:52.005 --> 00:25:53.765
Speaker 2: gonna keep sending him the jellies unless yeah.

00:25:53.765 --> 00:25:54.325
Speaker 0: It's insane.

00:25:54.325 --> 00:25:55.125
Speaker 0: Oh, even.

00:25:55.125 --> 00:25:56.645
Speaker 0: There was some subscription thing.

00:25:56.645 --> 00:25:58.245
Speaker 0: Then I was like, okay.

00:25:58.245 --> 00:25:59.285
Speaker 0: I'm you're on the phone.

00:25:59.285 --> 00:25:59.765
Speaker 0: Like, sorry.

00:25:59.765 --> 00:26:00.885
Speaker 0: My father's passed away.

00:26:00.885 --> 00:26:02.325
Speaker 0: He does not need this anymore.

00:26:02.325 --> 00:26:03.740
Speaker 0: Can you please cancel?

00:26:03.740 --> 00:26:05.260
Speaker 0: Oh, well, I'm not sure yet.

00:26:05.260 --> 00:26:08.540
Speaker 0: Can you give me a why would I make this up?

00:26:08.540 --> 00:26:08.780
Speaker 1: Right.

00:26:08.780 --> 00:26:11.100
Speaker 1: He's not watching Netflix anymore.

00:26:11.100 --> 00:26:11.580
Speaker 1: Exactly.

00:26:11.580 --> 00:26:12.700
Speaker 1: I could promise you that.

00:26:12.700 --> 00:26:13.180
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:26:13.180 --> 00:26:16.975
Speaker 0: And going through his computer, like, my mom would like, she never touched computers.

00:26:16.975 --> 00:26:20.815
Speaker 0: Like, literally, the only time she was on a computer when my father said,

00:26:20.815 --> 00:26:21.615
Speaker 0: Ruth, come over here.

00:26:21.615 --> 00:26:23.695
Speaker 0: I need you to type something up because I'm doing this.

00:26:23.695 --> 00:26:26.255
Speaker 0: And can you just at least type it a little bit and and then

00:26:26.255 --> 00:26:27.135
Speaker 0: I'll send it?

00:26:27.135 --> 00:26:28.735
Speaker 0: And so she didn't touch computer.

00:26:28.735 --> 00:26:31.980
Speaker 0: So all of a sudden, I had to get in control of his computer

00:26:31.980 --> 00:26:35.580
Speaker 0: because he was, you know, he was on Facebook, and he'd had all these

00:26:35.580 --> 00:26:36.140
Speaker 0: different things.

00:26:36.140 --> 00:26:39.260
Speaker 0: So it's like, well, how do you shut this down, and what do I

00:26:39.260 --> 00:26:39.980
Speaker 0: do about this?

00:26:39.980 --> 00:26:43.980
Speaker 0: And and so that was and and then again, like, again, no disrespect to

00:26:43.980 --> 00:26:46.700
Speaker 0: my brother, but he my brother's not even super tech savvy.

00:26:46.700 --> 00:26:47.815
Speaker 0: He'll probably listen to that stuff.

00:26:47.815 --> 00:26:48.615
Speaker 0: Don't be a jerk.

00:26:48.615 --> 00:26:51.015
Speaker 0: But, anyway

00:26:51.015 --> 00:26:52.375
Speaker 0: but but, no, he'll admit it.

00:26:52.375 --> 00:26:53.095
Speaker 0: He'll he'll agree.

00:26:53.095 --> 00:26:53.735
Speaker 0: He'll agree.

00:26:53.735 --> 00:26:53.935
Speaker 0: He'll agree.

00:26:53.855 --> 00:26:54.295
Speaker 0: He'll he'll agree.

00:26:54.295 --> 00:26:54.535
Speaker 0: He'll he'll agree.

00:26:54.535 --> 00:26:55.575
Speaker 2: He'll he'll guess next week.

00:26:55.575 --> 00:26:55.815
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:26:55.815 --> 00:26:56.695
Speaker 0: Exactly.

00:26:56.695 --> 00:26:57.335
Speaker 0: He's right there.

00:26:57.335 --> 00:26:57.975
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:26:57.975 --> 00:27:00.135
Speaker 0: He's here today.

00:27:00.135 --> 00:27:03.630
Speaker 0: Anyway, so so they're just doing that stuff, but we know the whole process

00:27:03.630 --> 00:27:04.670
Speaker 0: takes takes a while.

00:27:04.670 --> 00:27:07.470
Speaker 0: But I think to

00:27:07.470 --> 00:27:11.470
Speaker 0: then the the besides the checking things off and doing the things

00:27:11.630 --> 00:27:14.990
Speaker 0: you've got to do and not realizing how much stuff there is to do,

00:27:14.990 --> 00:27:16.695
Speaker 0: it then was, hey.

00:27:16.695 --> 00:27:19.815
Speaker 0: How do I make sure that my children are okay?

00:27:19.815 --> 00:27:20.855
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:27:20.855 --> 00:27:24.855
Speaker 0: My wife, who's become very fond of my father, is okay, but more importantly,

00:27:25.175 --> 00:27:25.975
Speaker 0: my mom.

00:27:25.975 --> 00:27:27.095
Speaker 0: How's my mom doing?

00:27:27.095 --> 00:27:28.215
Speaker 1: And how was she doing?

00:27:28.215 --> 00:27:29.815
Speaker 0: And,

00:27:29.815 --> 00:27:33.815
Speaker 0: she's she's pretty strong, but she had a, you know, strong on the outside

00:27:34.160 --> 00:27:37.120
Speaker 0: and falling apart on the inside at some level.

00:27:37.120 --> 00:27:41.120
Speaker 0: But, I think she I think, like, they were

00:27:42.240 --> 00:27:45.935
Speaker 0: you know, it's it's always I always look back, and I think there was

00:27:45.935 --> 00:27:48.575
Speaker 0: a number of times over my life where I'm like, god.

00:27:48.575 --> 00:27:52.575
Speaker 0: If I can have a marriage and a partnership like my parents had Right.

00:27:52.575 --> 00:27:56.575
Speaker 0: I'd be doing pretty well and because they were a good partnership and a

00:27:56.655 --> 00:28:00.655
Speaker 0: loving couple and, just a great a great couple.

00:28:00.990 --> 00:28:02.030
Speaker 0: Anyway, so I was like, okay.

00:28:02.030 --> 00:28:06.030
Speaker 0: I gotta make sure my mom's okay, and I'm and she was very stoical

00:28:06.270 --> 00:28:06.670
Speaker 0: about two.

00:28:06.670 --> 00:28:07.310
Speaker 0: She's like, hey.

00:28:07.310 --> 00:28:08.750
Speaker 0: Well, I gotta keep moving on.

00:28:08.750 --> 00:28:11.630
Speaker 0: But then she as the days went by, she's like, I don't know if

00:28:11.630 --> 00:28:12.875
Speaker 0: I can.

00:28:12.875 --> 00:28:16.155
Speaker 0: She started getting very, like,

00:28:16.155 --> 00:28:20.155
Speaker 0: con concerned with herself whether or not she can survive without her partner

00:28:20.315 --> 00:28:20.875
Speaker 0: in crime.

00:28:20.875 --> 00:28:21.435
Speaker 0: Mhmm.

00:28:21.435 --> 00:28:23.755
Speaker 2: Like, the day to day tasks you started to No.

00:28:23.755 --> 00:28:25.115
Speaker 0: It's not the day to day goal.

00:28:25.115 --> 00:28:26.155
Speaker 0: It's the emotional.

00:28:26.155 --> 00:28:30.155
Speaker 0: I've now lost my part my my lover, my best friend, my husband.

00:28:30.230 --> 00:28:31.270
Speaker 0: Like Right.

00:28:31.270 --> 00:28:35.270
Speaker 0: I've lost that person who keeps me going and is part of everything

00:28:35.350 --> 00:28:35.910
Speaker 0: I've done.

00:28:35.910 --> 00:28:39.910
Speaker 0: They're very both very social and and and, you know, with

00:28:40.150 --> 00:28:43.385
Speaker 0: a lot of friends and stuff, and now their her partner is not there.

00:28:43.385 --> 00:28:47.385
Speaker 0: So luckily, my mom was in a in Collingwood where she

00:28:47.465 --> 00:28:48.585
Speaker 0: grew up originally.

00:28:48.585 --> 00:28:48.825
Speaker 0: Mhmm.

00:28:48.825 --> 00:28:52.025
Speaker 0: And then they moved to Toronto, and I grew up in Toronto.

00:28:52.025 --> 00:28:55.110
Speaker 0: And then they moved back to Collingwood, Ontario,

00:28:55.110 --> 00:28:56.550
Speaker 0: later in life, and she retired there.

00:28:56.550 --> 00:28:59.990
Speaker 0: But she still had all these old friends from way back when or who

00:28:59.990 --> 00:29:01.910
Speaker 0: had moved there them themselves Right.

00:29:01.910 --> 00:29:02.470
Speaker 0: Later in life.

00:29:02.470 --> 00:29:06.150
Speaker 0: So she had a a good network, but I'm like, mom, you got all

00:29:06.150 --> 00:29:08.375
Speaker 0: these friends here, and you got all these she's like, yep.

00:29:08.375 --> 00:29:10.935
Speaker 0: But they're not my best friend.

00:29:10.935 --> 00:29:11.495
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:29:11.495 --> 00:29:14.455
Speaker 1: So And it's hard to hear that from your mother.

00:29:14.455 --> 00:29:18.455
Speaker 1: I I I don't know what your relationship was like with your mom, but

00:29:18.615 --> 00:29:21.095
Speaker 1: that is, like, the ultimate level of vulnerability.

00:29:21.095 --> 00:29:21.335
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:29:21.335 --> 00:29:24.910
Speaker 1: To hear that from your parents in that moment is just I I Yeah.

00:29:24.910 --> 00:29:28.270
Speaker 1: I found it heartbreaking when I I felt I heard something similar coming from

00:29:28.270 --> 00:29:29.470
Speaker 1: my mom as well.

00:29:29.470 --> 00:29:31.070
Speaker 1: Just you know it's coming.

00:29:31.070 --> 00:29:32.110
Speaker 1: You you you see it.

00:29:32.110 --> 00:29:32.750
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:29:32.750 --> 00:29:36.110
Speaker 1: You know, you see it coming, but when it actually happens, you're just like,

00:29:36.110 --> 00:29:36.590
Speaker 1: woah.

00:29:36.590 --> 00:29:36.910
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:29:36.910 --> 00:29:39.455
Speaker 2: But do you

00:29:39.455 --> 00:29:41.615
Speaker 2: do you become your dad in a certain way?

00:29:41.615 --> 00:29:44.815
Speaker 2: Like, she she has needs Yeah.

00:29:44.815 --> 00:29:45.535
Speaker 2: The of certain things.

00:29:45.535 --> 00:29:45.855
Speaker 2: Right?

00:29:45.855 --> 00:29:46.495
Speaker 0: Like Yes.

00:29:46.495 --> 00:29:47.935
Speaker 2: And who's she gonna ask?

00:29:47.935 --> 00:29:51.215
Speaker 2: And you're obviously no shade against your brother because that's Yeah.

00:29:51.215 --> 00:29:52.895
Speaker 2: But it's it sounds like it's gonna be you.

00:29:52.895 --> 00:29:56.895
Speaker 2: And so there's this scenario where you're like, suddenly, not only is my dad

00:29:56.950 --> 00:29:58.390
Speaker 2: not here that I have to deal with Yeah.

00:29:58.390 --> 00:29:59.750
Speaker 2: But also I am him.

00:29:59.750 --> 00:30:00.150
Speaker 2: Right.

00:30:00.150 --> 00:30:01.270
Speaker 2: Is that a signal?

00:30:01.270 --> 00:30:01.750
Speaker 2: Or

00:30:01.750 --> 00:30:03.270
Speaker 0: Funny enough you say I am him.

00:30:03.270 --> 00:30:06.870
Speaker 0: Like, one of the feelings is when my dad passed was like, okay.

00:30:06.870 --> 00:30:09.510
Speaker 0: I'm the oldest male in my family.

00:30:09.510 --> 00:30:10.150
Speaker 0: Right.

00:30:10.150 --> 00:30:12.285
Speaker 0: I am now my dad.

00:30:12.285 --> 00:30:12.525
Speaker 0: Wow.

00:30:12.525 --> 00:30:16.525
Speaker 0: And my own,

00:30:17.965 --> 00:30:19.485
Speaker 0: like, belief of, like, oh my god.

00:30:19.485 --> 00:30:21.085
Speaker 0: I'm suddenly like, wait a second.

00:30:21.085 --> 00:30:22.045
Speaker 0: How old am I?

00:30:22.045 --> 00:30:22.765
Speaker 0: Oh my god.

00:30:22.765 --> 00:30:23.165
Speaker 0: Okay.

00:30:23.165 --> 00:30:24.690
Speaker 0: My dad died at eighty six.

00:30:24.690 --> 00:30:26.610
Speaker 0: Oh, that's, like, thirty years from now for me.

00:30:26.610 --> 00:30:26.850
Speaker 0: Right?

00:30:26.850 --> 00:30:29.170
Speaker 0: Or at the time was thirty three.

00:30:29.170 --> 00:30:31.330
Speaker 0: I'm like, oh, wow.

00:30:31.330 --> 00:30:33.112
Speaker 0: I'm closer to death than I am birth.

00:30:33.112 --> 00:30:33.312
Speaker 0: Okay.

00:30:33.123 --> 00:30:33.323
Speaker 0: Oh, yeah.

00:30:33.145 --> 00:30:33.345
Speaker 0: This is, this is interesting now.

00:30:33.221 --> 00:30:33.421
Speaker 0: Put down cheeseburger.

00:30:33.275 --> 00:30:37.275
Speaker 0: Somebody said it to me, and I

00:30:37.975 --> 00:30:38.935
Speaker 1: interesting now.

00:30:38.935 --> 00:30:39.902
Speaker 0: Put down cheeseburger.

00:30:39.902 --> 00:30:40.102
Speaker 0: Somebody

00:30:40.095 --> 00:30:41.495
Speaker 2: said it to me, and I don't know.

00:30:41.495 --> 00:30:44.695
Speaker 2: This is a visual that I always get is, like, until your until your

00:30:44.695 --> 00:30:47.815
Speaker 2: dad dies, and he's there's a roof on your house

00:30:47.815 --> 00:30:48.135
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:30:48.135 --> 00:30:49.655
Speaker 2: And then suddenly, there's no roof.

00:30:49.655 --> 00:30:51.575
Speaker 2: And the rain just lands directly on your head.

00:30:51.575 --> 00:30:51.775
Speaker 0: Right.

00:30:51.735 --> 00:30:51.935
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:30:51.895 --> 00:30:53.500
Speaker 2: And you're like, oh, so I'm the one now.

00:30:53.500 --> 00:30:54.220
Speaker 2: I'm the roof.

00:30:54.220 --> 00:30:54.700
Speaker 0: I yeah.

00:30:54.700 --> 00:30:55.580
Speaker 2: Suddenly, I'm shooting

00:30:55.580 --> 00:30:55.820
Speaker 0: the roof.

00:30:55.820 --> 00:30:56.460
Speaker 0: Analogy.

00:30:56.460 --> 00:30:57.020
Speaker 0: I love that.

00:30:57.020 --> 00:31:00.060
Speaker 2: And the feeling of pressure Mhmm.

00:31:00.060 --> 00:31:01.900
Speaker 2: Is is considerable, I think.

00:31:01.900 --> 00:31:02.100
Speaker 0: We're

00:31:02.060 --> 00:31:04.780
Speaker 2: starting to think, jeez, what do I need to do to be am I

00:31:04.780 --> 00:31:05.900
Speaker 2: ready for that level of

00:31:05.900 --> 00:31:06.220
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:31:06.220 --> 00:31:07.260
Speaker 2: Of responsibility?

00:31:07.260 --> 00:31:10.135
Speaker 2: So I did that hit you, or is that just hitting you now?

00:31:10.135 --> 00:31:10.535
Speaker 0: Oh, no.

00:31:10.535 --> 00:31:13.255
Speaker 0: That hit me very soon after it was passed.

00:31:13.255 --> 00:31:14.255
Speaker 0: Like, right away, pretty much.

00:31:14.255 --> 00:31:15.415
Speaker 0: I was like, oh, wow.

00:31:15.415 --> 00:31:17.335
Speaker 0: That's now I'm I'm my dad.

00:31:17.335 --> 00:31:18.295
Speaker 0: I'm the oldest guy.

00:31:18.295 --> 00:31:22.295
Speaker 0: I'm now, you know, gotta be a rock and be whatever.

00:31:22.650 --> 00:31:26.650
Speaker 1: And and where where are you at with that now?

00:31:27.850 --> 00:31:28.170
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:31:28.170 --> 00:31:31.850
Speaker 0: I don't think I'm as emotional as I was when I first kind of

00:31:31.850 --> 00:31:35.735
Speaker 0: had that realization.

00:31:35.735 --> 00:31:39.015
Speaker 0: I think what's happened over the last you know, coming to terms with my

00:31:39.015 --> 00:31:43.015
Speaker 0: father's passing, it's to me people when someone

00:31:43.095 --> 00:31:46.855
Speaker 0: I found when when he passed, people like, oh, what do you what do

00:31:46.855 --> 00:31:49.975
Speaker 0: you think about all the memories, and you think about all the stuff in

00:31:49.975 --> 00:31:50.375
Speaker 0: the past.

00:31:50.375 --> 00:31:51.970
Speaker 0: And tell me some stories.

00:31:51.970 --> 00:31:55.970
Speaker 0: And I'm like, I I'm I'm not the best storyteller per se, or

00:31:55.970 --> 00:31:56.930
Speaker 0: I don't think I am.

00:31:56.930 --> 00:31:59.650
Speaker 0: But I'd be like, it's not about the stories I had with him.

00:31:59.650 --> 00:32:03.650
Speaker 0: It's about who he helped me become in my head and in my heart.

00:32:04.325 --> 00:32:08.325
Speaker 0: And and and I think every day, I try to be

00:32:08.325 --> 00:32:08.965
Speaker 0: a good person.

00:32:08.965 --> 00:32:12.725
Speaker 0: So I think my father my father was not perfect by any means, but

00:32:12.725 --> 00:32:16.725
Speaker 0: he had, in general, he was a good good person.

00:32:17.160 --> 00:32:18.120
Speaker 0: And so I'm thinking, okay.

00:32:18.120 --> 00:32:20.440
Speaker 0: What are all the things he's taught me?

00:32:20.440 --> 00:32:22.040
Speaker 0: And so that's where I'm at now.

00:32:22.040 --> 00:32:25.560
Speaker 0: It's like, let just keep living.

00:32:25.560 --> 00:32:29.560
Speaker 0: His memory is now in me, in my mind, in my heart, and be

00:32:29.880 --> 00:32:32.785
Speaker 0: the person I could be that he probably was trying to instill in me

00:32:32.785 --> 00:32:36.785
Speaker 0: when I was eight, ten, twelve, eighteen, twenty seven, thirty

00:32:36.785 --> 00:32:38.625
Speaker 0: two, you know, etcetera.

00:32:38.625 --> 00:32:39.025
Speaker 0: Right?

00:32:39.025 --> 00:32:43.025
Speaker 2: Is there a thing that you do or have done recently that you're

00:32:43.105 --> 00:32:46.050
Speaker 2: surprised that you actually went, oh, this is his thing that I got from

00:32:46.050 --> 00:32:46.290
Speaker 2: him.

00:32:46.290 --> 00:32:49.210
Speaker 2: So it sounds like there's some obvious things that you can you can draw

00:32:49.210 --> 00:32:52.210
Speaker 2: a line to, but I'm sometimes there's these surprises.

00:32:52.210 --> 00:32:56.210
Speaker 2: You're like, you've inherited a a trait or a characteristic or even a

00:32:56.210 --> 00:32:57.090
Speaker 2: way of thinking

00:32:57.090 --> 00:32:57.330
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:32:57.330 --> 00:33:00.995
Speaker 2: That has come to light just recently or after he passed.

00:33:00.995 --> 00:33:02.595
Speaker 0: Oh, I I definitely could say there is.

00:33:02.595 --> 00:33:05.075
Speaker 0: I I can't think of, like, top of my head now, but a hundred

00:33:05.075 --> 00:33:05.315
Speaker 0: percent.

00:33:05.315 --> 00:33:07.395
Speaker 0: There's like you'll do something like, oh my god.

00:33:07.395 --> 00:33:08.435
Speaker 0: That's what my dad would do.

00:33:08.435 --> 00:33:08.915
Speaker 2: That's what

00:33:08.915 --> 00:33:10.675
Speaker 0: that's what my dad would say.

00:33:10.675 --> 00:33:11.875
Speaker 2: Or Oh, that's the weirdest.

00:33:11.875 --> 00:33:12.675
Speaker 2: Oh, that's the weirdest.

00:33:12.675 --> 00:33:13.635
Speaker 0: My dad would have said that.

00:33:13.635 --> 00:33:14.340
Speaker 0: I'm like, alright.

00:33:14.340 --> 00:33:15.540
Speaker 0: Try to get to my father.

00:33:15.540 --> 00:33:17.620
Speaker 1: And then your wife and then your wife calls it out and is like

00:33:17.620 --> 00:33:17.820
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:33:17.780 --> 00:33:18.740
Speaker 1: You sound like your dad.

00:33:18.740 --> 00:33:18.980
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:33:18.980 --> 00:33:19.220
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:33:19.220 --> 00:33:19.460
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:33:19.460 --> 00:33:20.260
Speaker 0: Exactly.

00:33:20.260 --> 00:33:23.780
Speaker 2: He I never like, your laugh is a natural thing that is that is

00:33:23.780 --> 00:33:24.180
Speaker 2: in you.

00:33:24.180 --> 00:33:24.420
Speaker 2: Right?

00:33:24.420 --> 00:33:27.645
Speaker 2: It's supposed to come from you and and a creation of everything.

00:33:27.645 --> 00:33:30.765
Speaker 2: And up until my father passed away, I laughed one way.

00:33:30.765 --> 00:33:30.965
Speaker 2: Right.

00:33:30.925 --> 00:33:34.472
Speaker 2: And then after he passed away, I I somebody told me this thing, and

00:33:34.472 --> 00:33:36.125
Speaker 2: I went,

00:33:36.125 --> 00:33:40.125
Speaker 2: which is which is his weird chuckle, which never was my laugh before.

00:33:40.205 --> 00:33:42.880
Speaker 2: And I was, you know, I was turning around like, where

00:33:42.880 --> 00:33:43.120
Speaker 0: is he?

00:33:43.120 --> 00:33:44.480
Speaker 0: Where does he come from?

00:33:44.480 --> 00:33:46.160
Speaker 2: This laugh came out of nowhere.

00:33:46.160 --> 00:33:46.480
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:33:46.480 --> 00:33:49.280
Speaker 2: And my sister, she was like, I What was that?

00:33:49.280 --> 00:33:50.000
Speaker 2: She was like, what was that?

00:33:50.000 --> 00:33:53.760
Speaker 2: And I was like, oh, it was it was the weirdest feeling of just

00:33:53.760 --> 00:33:54.560
Speaker 2: being inhabited.

00:33:54.560 --> 00:33:54.965
Speaker 2: Right.

00:33:54.965 --> 00:33:56.325
Speaker 2: And this laugh still exists.

00:33:56.325 --> 00:33:57.125
Speaker 2: I can't get rid of it.

00:33:57.125 --> 00:33:58.165
Speaker 2: I can't shake it.

00:33:58.165 --> 00:33:58.805
Speaker 1: He's in you.

00:33:58.805 --> 00:33:59.525
Speaker 0: He's in you.

00:33:59.525 --> 00:33:59.725
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:33:59.685 --> 00:34:00.085
Speaker 0: Exactly.

00:34:00.085 --> 00:34:00.325
Speaker 0: It's a

00:34:00.325 --> 00:34:01.045
Speaker 2: spooky thing.

00:34:01.045 --> 00:34:01.525
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:34:01.525 --> 00:34:02.565
Speaker 2: So yeah.

00:34:02.565 --> 00:34:05.685
Speaker 2: So I glad you don't have that paranormal scenario.

00:34:05.685 --> 00:34:05.885
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:34:05.845 --> 00:34:06.725
Speaker 0: No.

00:34:06.725 --> 00:34:07.165
Speaker 0: No.

00:34:07.165 --> 00:34:11.165
Speaker 2: You said something too, which I thought was interesting, which is that there's a

00:34:11.400 --> 00:34:14.520
Speaker 2: servicing of other people's expectations.

00:34:14.520 --> 00:34:17.480
Speaker 2: They come up to you, and they want stories about your dad or they

00:34:17.480 --> 00:34:18.360
Speaker 2: wanna know things.

00:34:18.360 --> 00:34:18.680
Speaker 0: Right.

00:34:18.680 --> 00:34:21.320
Speaker 2: How do you handle that when someone comes up to you and says, like,

00:34:21.320 --> 00:34:23.335
Speaker 2: oh, you know, I'm sorry your dad died.

00:34:23.335 --> 00:34:26.855
Speaker 2: And then they're performatively kinda talking to you about your grief.

00:34:26.855 --> 00:34:27.335
Speaker 2: Right.

00:34:27.335 --> 00:34:31.175
Speaker 2: Is that a familiarity to you, and how do you handle it?

00:34:31.175 --> 00:34:35.175
Speaker 0: When you just mentioned your story about, you know, thinking your father was

00:34:35.655 --> 00:34:39.655
Speaker 0: behind you with your laugh, the one thing that's happened to me is

00:34:39.710 --> 00:34:43.710
Speaker 0: more very vivid dreams where your my father and

00:34:43.950 --> 00:34:47.070
Speaker 0: now my mother because she passed as well a couple years ago, is that

00:34:47.070 --> 00:34:50.670
Speaker 0: they'll come into my dreams or they'll be in a dream, and I will

00:34:50.670 --> 00:34:53.870
Speaker 0: literally wake up thinking that they're in the room.

00:34:53.870 --> 00:34:57.870
Speaker 0: Like, it's it's not like a like, it's like they inserted themselves

00:34:58.015 --> 00:35:01.135
Speaker 0: into a dream, like, from above or from wherever they are.

00:35:01.135 --> 00:35:01.375
Speaker 0: Right?

00:35:01.375 --> 00:35:02.415
Speaker 0: Right?

00:35:02.415 --> 00:35:05.135
Speaker 0: So I have those every once in a while, and I wake up really

00:35:05.135 --> 00:35:05.535
Speaker 0: emotional.

00:35:05.535 --> 00:35:06.255
Speaker 0: Like, oh my god.

00:35:06.255 --> 00:35:08.040
Speaker 0: I miss my father so much or my mother.

00:35:08.040 --> 00:35:12.040
Speaker 0: And but it's like because the dream is just not that normal, weird dream

00:35:12.440 --> 00:35:14.280
Speaker 0: where people just happen to be in a room.

00:35:14.280 --> 00:35:14.600
Speaker 0: Right?

00:35:14.600 --> 00:35:16.520
Speaker 0: This is where they talk to you.

00:35:16.520 --> 00:35:17.960
Speaker 0: And you're like, but, dad, you're dead.

00:35:17.960 --> 00:35:18.760
Speaker 0: Oh, it's okay.

00:35:18.760 --> 00:35:20.735
Speaker 0: I came back today to talk to you about something.

00:35:20.735 --> 00:35:22.975
Speaker 0: Oh, do you remember when this happened or whatever?

00:35:22.975 --> 00:35:25.375
Speaker 0: And it's one of those sort of conversations.

00:35:25.375 --> 00:35:26.735
Speaker 0: I have those.

00:35:26.735 --> 00:35:27.935
Speaker 0: I wish I had those.

00:35:27.935 --> 00:35:29.455
Speaker 2: Have you ever you've never had your dad

00:35:29.455 --> 00:35:29.695
Speaker 0: or your

00:35:29.695 --> 00:35:30.335
Speaker 2: dad before?

00:35:30.335 --> 00:35:33.615
Speaker 1: In fact, when when he passed, one of the things I asked him or

00:35:33.615 --> 00:35:35.780
Speaker 1: I said to him was, you know, hey.

00:35:35.780 --> 00:35:36.820
Speaker 1: You don't know where you're going.

00:35:36.820 --> 00:35:37.940
Speaker 1: I don't know where you're going,

00:35:37.940 --> 00:35:38.140
Speaker 0: but

00:35:38.100 --> 00:35:41.380
Speaker 1: I just hope that at some point you come and visit me in whatever

00:35:41.380 --> 00:35:42.180
Speaker 1: form.

00:35:42.180 --> 00:35:45.220
Speaker 1: And I always think about, like, could it come in a dream or could

00:35:45.220 --> 00:35:46.660
Speaker 1: it be someone so it's interesting to me.

00:35:46.660 --> 00:35:47.380
Speaker 1: I was like, no.

00:35:47.380 --> 00:35:48.685
Speaker 1: That'd be that'd be awesome.

00:35:48.685 --> 00:35:48.885
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:35:48.845 --> 00:35:49.725
Speaker 1: It hasn't happened yet.

00:35:49.725 --> 00:35:52.685
Speaker 0: It is awesome, but it's very emotional because you wake up from the dream

00:35:52.685 --> 00:35:53.325
Speaker 0: and you go, god.

00:35:53.325 --> 00:35:53.885
Speaker 0: That's a dream.

00:35:53.885 --> 00:35:54.125
Speaker 0: Damn it.

00:35:54.125 --> 00:35:55.405
Speaker 0: I wish that was not a dream.

00:35:55.405 --> 00:35:57.005
Speaker 0: I want him to be here now No.

00:35:57.005 --> 00:35:57.325
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:35:57.325 --> 00:35:58.445
Speaker 0: To continue the conversation.

00:35:58.445 --> 00:36:02.445
Speaker 0: Usually, it's it's a real life conversation or a dream conversation you're having.

00:36:02.765 --> 00:36:03.110
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:36:03.110 --> 00:36:03.310
Speaker 0: It feels

00:36:03.310 --> 00:36:04.550
Speaker 1: like it feels so real.

00:36:04.550 --> 00:36:05.750
Speaker 1: There's no there's no yeah.

00:36:05.750 --> 00:36:08.870
Speaker 0: The and then and then suddenly, it it ends, and you're like, but but

00:36:08.870 --> 00:36:09.670
Speaker 0: I had more questions.

00:36:09.670 --> 00:36:11.910
Speaker 0: I wanted to talk about something else or whatever.

00:36:11.910 --> 00:36:12.550
Speaker 0: And it's Awesome.

00:36:12.550 --> 00:36:12.950
Speaker 0: Did you

00:36:12.950 --> 00:36:13.750
Speaker 1: see the Blue Jays?

00:36:13.750 --> 00:36:14.150
Speaker 1: You know?

00:36:14.150 --> 00:36:14.870
Speaker 0: Well, exactly.

00:36:14.870 --> 00:36:15.670
Speaker 0: He would have loved

00:36:15.670 --> 00:36:16.470
Speaker 1: to see the Blue

00:36:16.470 --> 00:36:16.670
Speaker 0: Jays.

00:36:16.630 --> 00:36:17.910
Speaker 0: I mean Totally.

00:36:17.910 --> 00:36:18.755
Speaker 1: He was a huge fan.

00:36:18.755 --> 00:36:20.595
Speaker 1: He would have loved to have been there for that.

00:36:20.595 --> 00:36:21.555
Speaker 1: Mine mine too.

00:36:21.555 --> 00:36:22.595
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:36:22.595 --> 00:36:26.595
Speaker 1: So, you know, we're we're now at the stage of of of

00:36:26.595 --> 00:36:27.075
Speaker 1: grief.

00:36:27.075 --> 00:36:29.875
Speaker 1: Where do you think you're at with it all right now, and and how

00:36:29.875 --> 00:36:32.130
Speaker 1: do you think you're doing with it?

00:36:32.130 --> 00:36:32.850
Speaker 1: Because it's not Yeah.

00:36:32.850 --> 00:36:33.890
Speaker 1: There's no rule book.

00:36:33.890 --> 00:36:35.970
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:36:35.970 --> 00:36:39.250
Speaker 1: What what, you know, what what do you think is is is working for

00:36:39.250 --> 00:36:39.490
Speaker 1: you?

00:36:39.490 --> 00:36:41.170
Speaker 1: What is is there anything missing?

00:36:41.170 --> 00:36:43.010
Speaker 1: Like, where where do you think you're at right now?

00:36:43.010 --> 00:36:47.010
Speaker 2: Because what I heard from you say, which I think is very admirable, it's

00:36:47.025 --> 00:36:49.025
Speaker 2: about checking in my mom, and she's passing away now.

00:36:49.025 --> 00:36:50.145
Speaker 2: It's about checking in my wife.

00:36:50.145 --> 00:36:52.145
Speaker 2: It's about making sure my kids are okay.

00:36:52.145 --> 00:36:52.345
Speaker 0: It's

00:36:52.305 --> 00:36:56.305
Speaker 2: about there are a lot of people with whom we care and are Yeah.

00:36:56.305 --> 00:37:00.110
Speaker 2: Concerned with keeping the roof over their heads.

00:37:00.110 --> 00:37:02.350
Speaker 2: The roof is not over your head.

00:37:02.350 --> 00:37:04.270
Speaker 2: How do you how are you managing with that?

00:37:04.270 --> 00:37:07.230
Speaker 2: Like, is that do you let that hit you, or do you kind of

00:37:07.230 --> 00:37:09.070
Speaker 2: keep that in a in a scenario?

00:37:09.070 --> 00:37:11.150
Speaker 2: What's the what's the real life feeling for it?

00:37:11.150 --> 00:37:15.150
Speaker 0: Well, I think the real life thing is is making sure that my children

00:37:15.505 --> 00:37:17.425
Speaker 0: still know about their pop up.

00:37:17.425 --> 00:37:17.745
Speaker 0: Mhmm.

00:37:17.745 --> 00:37:18.145
Speaker 0: Right?

00:37:18.145 --> 00:37:21.425
Speaker 0: Because there was only a short period of time that they had with them,

00:37:21.425 --> 00:37:24.625
Speaker 0: and then but I know and, obviously, him being out east and we're out

00:37:24.625 --> 00:37:24.945
Speaker 0: west.

00:37:24.945 --> 00:37:28.225
Speaker 0: So when they spent time together, it was only for a few weeks of

00:37:28.225 --> 00:37:30.240
Speaker 0: every year, but it was pretty condensed.

00:37:30.240 --> 00:37:30.440
Speaker 0: Mhmm.

00:37:30.400 --> 00:37:32.320
Speaker 0: And they would go and do stuff and all that.

00:37:32.320 --> 00:37:35.280
Speaker 0: So I just wanna make sure that they've got photos, and we talk about

00:37:35.280 --> 00:37:37.520
Speaker 0: them and and and that those types of things.

00:37:37.520 --> 00:37:41.520
Speaker 0: So to me, that's really important so that they can as they grow,

00:37:41.840 --> 00:37:45.840
Speaker 0: they still remember when they were six and nine before he passed

00:37:46.135 --> 00:37:47.415
Speaker 0: and and all that stuff.

00:37:47.415 --> 00:37:49.895
Speaker 2: Do you have a special thing that you do to keep him alive?

00:37:49.895 --> 00:37:52.055
Speaker 2: Like, do you have a commemorative, like you mentioned

00:37:52.055 --> 00:37:52.375
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:37:52.375 --> 00:37:54.055
Speaker 2: His birthday maybe or something?

00:37:54.055 --> 00:37:57.095
Speaker 2: Is there is there a date of the calendar that kind of gets reserved

00:37:57.095 --> 00:37:58.730
Speaker 2: for him?

00:37:58.730 --> 00:38:01.130
Speaker 2: No.

00:38:01.130 --> 00:38:02.730
Speaker 0: But you said there's not a special date?

00:38:02.730 --> 00:38:02.930
Speaker 0: No.

00:38:02.890 --> 00:38:03.130
Speaker 0: No.

00:38:03.130 --> 00:38:04.090
Speaker 0: It's just But it's I have

00:38:04.090 --> 00:38:05.050
Speaker 2: to keep him alive, I think,

00:38:05.050 --> 00:38:05.850
Speaker 0: in the memory.

00:38:05.850 --> 00:38:07.930
Speaker 0: It's keep him alive, and I do reference them.

00:38:07.930 --> 00:38:11.930
Speaker 0: And and my children do have photos of them with my father

00:38:11.930 --> 00:38:14.875
Speaker 0: and with my mother, like, in their rooms.

00:38:14.875 --> 00:38:15.195
Speaker 0: Mhmm.

00:38:15.195 --> 00:38:16.875
Speaker 0: And they're there, so they see them.

00:38:16.875 --> 00:38:20.875
Speaker 0: And I'm actually really sometimes they're surprised because, you know, kids' rooms can be

00:38:20.875 --> 00:38:23.595
Speaker 0: the disaster zones, and things could go missing.

00:38:23.595 --> 00:38:26.875
Speaker 0: And then but seems that those photos don't go missing.

00:38:26.875 --> 00:38:28.940
Speaker 0: They're always there, and they've always made sure.

00:38:28.940 --> 00:38:32.940
Speaker 0: So and when I bring them bring up my my my father and

00:38:33.020 --> 00:38:37.020
Speaker 0: mother and and they still have fond memories, and they they talk

00:38:37.180 --> 00:38:37.660
Speaker 0: about things.

00:38:37.660 --> 00:38:39.900
Speaker 0: Like, my daughter sometimes gets a little bit emotional.

00:38:39.900 --> 00:38:41.580
Speaker 0: Like, I I miss nanny and papa.

00:38:41.580 --> 00:38:42.745
Speaker 0: Mhmm.

00:38:42.745 --> 00:38:46.265
Speaker 0: But, I think that's to me is the big thing is making sure that

00:38:46.265 --> 00:38:48.185
Speaker 0: they're thinking about them.

00:38:48.185 --> 00:38:49.865
Speaker 1: You brought some fur photos with you.

00:38:49.865 --> 00:38:52.345
Speaker 1: I I I would love to, learn more about them.

00:38:52.345 --> 00:38:52.585
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:38:52.585 --> 00:38:56.585
Speaker 0: So this is actually a photo of me and my brothers as little kids.

00:38:56.950 --> 00:39:00.310
Speaker 0: And even though it's not my father, the reason it's important is because we're

00:39:00.310 --> 00:39:03.670
Speaker 0: sitting in an old wooden boat on Lake Abays Mhmm.

00:39:03.670 --> 00:39:06.310
Speaker 0: In Ontario where the cottage is.

00:39:06.310 --> 00:39:07.670
Speaker 0: So which one are you?

00:39:07.670 --> 00:39:11.670
Speaker 0: So I'm the super blonde one in the red, like, pajamas.

00:39:12.005 --> 00:39:13.845
Speaker 2: I like this outfit.

00:39:13.845 --> 00:39:14.525
Speaker 2: I like this outfit.

00:39:14.525 --> 00:39:15.205
Speaker 0: I mean, this

00:39:15.205 --> 00:39:15.525
Speaker 1: is, like This

00:39:15.525 --> 00:39:16.005
Speaker 2: is a good

00:39:16.005 --> 00:39:19.685
Speaker 0: looking nineteen seventy four or five, probably.

00:39:19.685 --> 00:39:20.245
Speaker 0: Beautiful.

00:39:20.245 --> 00:39:23.445
Speaker 0: And then my younger brother's in the middle, and my older brother's the top.

00:39:23.445 --> 00:39:25.045
Speaker 0: He passed away a number of years ago.

00:39:25.045 --> 00:39:29.045
Speaker 0: So so it's just three and I think so it's it's about seeing my

00:39:29.140 --> 00:39:33.140
Speaker 0: brothers, but it it reminds me of my mom and dad because

00:39:35.700 --> 00:39:38.900
Speaker 0: of being lucky enough and grateful enough to be able to go to a

00:39:38.900 --> 00:39:42.900
Speaker 0: a summer cottage and spend time together as a family and friends and everything.

00:39:42.985 --> 00:39:45.065
Speaker 1: Six and a half, two, and four.

00:39:45.065 --> 00:39:45.265
Speaker 0: Right.

00:39:45.225 --> 00:39:46.025
Speaker 0: And,

00:39:46.025 --> 00:39:47.545
Speaker 2: you're no stranger to grief.

00:39:47.545 --> 00:39:48.905
Speaker 2: You're mentioning several things.

00:39:48.905 --> 00:39:50.105
Speaker 2: Your mom's passed away.

00:39:50.105 --> 00:39:50.425
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:39:50.425 --> 00:39:52.105
Speaker 2: Your older brother's passed away.

00:39:52.105 --> 00:39:52.585
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:39:52.585 --> 00:39:56.120
Speaker 0: So My mom passed away two years ago Yeah.

00:39:56.120 --> 00:39:57.480
Speaker 0: Or almost two years ago.

00:39:57.480 --> 00:39:58.680
Speaker 0: And then my brother

00:39:58.680 --> 00:39:59.880
Speaker 2: a few years after your dad.

00:39:59.880 --> 00:40:00.280
Speaker 0: Like, sorry.

00:40:00.280 --> 00:40:01.240
Speaker 0: One year after your dad.

00:40:01.240 --> 00:40:01.880
Speaker 2: After your dad.

00:40:01.880 --> 00:40:02.080
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:40:02.040 --> 00:40:02.840
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:40:02.840 --> 00:40:06.840
Speaker 0: And my older brother passed away in, I think, it was two thousand three.

00:40:07.775 --> 00:40:08.815
Speaker 2: So oh, so

00:40:08.815 --> 00:40:09.055
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:40:09.055 --> 00:40:10.175
Speaker 0: So quite a few years back.

00:40:10.175 --> 00:40:11.135
Speaker 2: Difficult situation.

00:40:11.135 --> 00:40:11.455
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:40:11.455 --> 00:40:11.695
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:40:11.695 --> 00:40:13.455
Speaker 2: My parents out in my yeah.

00:40:13.455 --> 00:40:13.855
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:40:13.855 --> 00:40:14.095
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:40:14.095 --> 00:40:15.375
Speaker 0: So that was that was hard.

00:40:15.375 --> 00:40:16.495
Speaker 2: You have grief in your life.

00:40:16.495 --> 00:40:18.175
Speaker 2: You have had some familiarity with it.

00:40:18.175 --> 00:40:18.495
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:40:18.495 --> 00:40:19.935
Speaker 2: This is not your first experience.

00:40:19.935 --> 00:40:20.335
Speaker 0: Right.

00:40:20.335 --> 00:40:20.815
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:40:20.815 --> 00:40:22.200
Speaker 0: No.

00:40:22.200 --> 00:40:24.680
Speaker 0: And then the other photo, this is my father.

00:40:24.680 --> 00:40:25.800
Speaker 0: I can't remember.

00:40:25.800 --> 00:40:29.480
Speaker 0: He, like I told you, he was always volunteering, getting involved.

00:40:29.480 --> 00:40:33.480
Speaker 0: He actually went to Ottawa and got, caring caring

00:40:34.040 --> 00:40:35.160
Speaker 0: Canadian award.

00:40:35.160 --> 00:40:35.695
Speaker 0: Wow.

00:40:35.695 --> 00:40:36.735
Speaker 2: Is that what the medals are for?

00:40:36.735 --> 00:40:37.935
Speaker 0: I'm like, oh, wow.

00:40:37.935 --> 00:40:41.935
Speaker 0: So so he got medals as being a caring Canadian, and he got,

00:40:42.015 --> 00:40:45.455
Speaker 0: I think, the the governor general at the time I think his last name

00:40:45.455 --> 00:40:46.095
Speaker 0: was Johnson.

00:40:46.095 --> 00:40:47.455
Speaker 0: I can't remember his first name.

00:40:47.455 --> 00:40:49.100
Speaker 2: He was the one all the governor generals.

00:40:49.100 --> 00:40:49.420
Speaker 1: Yes.

00:40:49.420 --> 00:40:49.900
Speaker 1: You got it right.

00:40:49.900 --> 00:40:50.940
Speaker 1: It was Johnson Johnson,

00:40:50.940 --> 00:40:54.460
Speaker 0: and he's the one that gave him the award and and, and all this

00:40:54.460 --> 00:40:54.660
Speaker 0: stuff.

00:40:54.620 --> 00:40:57.340
Speaker 0: And I think it was one of those things it's funny because I don't

00:40:57.340 --> 00:41:01.020
Speaker 0: know if he kind of was, like, nominated himself, but then needed somebody else

00:41:01.020 --> 00:41:04.285
Speaker 0: to officially nominate him.

00:41:04.285 --> 00:41:07.965
Speaker 0: But, you know, he was I was proud of him, and and I didn't

00:41:07.965 --> 00:41:08.285
Speaker 0: go.

00:41:08.285 --> 00:41:11.725
Speaker 0: My brother went with my mom to the ceremony.

00:41:11.725 --> 00:41:12.525
Speaker 0: I'm trying to think.

00:41:12.525 --> 00:41:14.125
Speaker 0: It was what year it was?

00:41:14.125 --> 00:41:17.005
Speaker 0: It was about was it is there a date on that?

00:41:17.005 --> 00:41:17.325
Speaker 1: No?

00:41:17.325 --> 00:41:17.645
Speaker 1: No.

00:41:17.645 --> 00:41:19.245
Speaker 1: Still the queen?

00:41:19.245 --> 00:41:19.620
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:41:19.620 --> 00:41:22.420
Speaker 0: It was I think it was about over ten years ago Okay.

00:41:22.420 --> 00:41:23.460
Speaker 0: When that happened.

00:41:23.460 --> 00:41:23.780
Speaker 0: Wow.

00:41:23.780 --> 00:41:24.900
Speaker 0: And, yeah.

00:41:24.900 --> 00:41:26.100
Speaker 2: Looks like a happy guy.

00:41:26.100 --> 00:41:27.220
Speaker 1: Does.

00:41:27.220 --> 00:41:28.340
Speaker 1: Looks like a salesman.

00:41:28.340 --> 00:41:28.820
Speaker 0: Yes.

00:41:28.820 --> 00:41:29.700
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:41:29.700 --> 00:41:31.540
Speaker 2: Well, he sold himself into these awards.

00:41:31.540 --> 00:41:31.860
Speaker 0: He did.

00:41:31.860 --> 00:41:33.620
Speaker 0: I think he pretty much did.

00:41:33.620 --> 00:41:34.020
Speaker 0: That's not

00:41:34.020 --> 00:41:34.995
Speaker 2: your average salesperson.

00:41:34.995 --> 00:41:35.475
Speaker 0: No.

00:41:35.475 --> 00:41:36.435
Speaker 0: I think he did.

00:41:36.435 --> 00:41:37.715
Speaker 0: I think he yes.

00:41:37.715 --> 00:41:38.675
Speaker 1: Hearing Canadian.

00:41:38.675 --> 00:41:41.635
Speaker 1: Yes.

00:41:41.635 --> 00:41:43.715
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:41:43.715 --> 00:41:44.515
Speaker 1: So I'm curious.

00:41:44.515 --> 00:41:48.035
Speaker 1: What's something you know, you've had all this experience with grief.

00:41:48.035 --> 00:41:52.035
Speaker 1: What's something that you think men in particular should know about grief

00:41:52.250 --> 00:41:54.490
Speaker 1: that you think not enough of

00:41:54.490 --> 00:41:54.970
Speaker 0: them do?

00:41:54.970 --> 00:41:56.810
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:41:56.810 --> 00:41:58.970
Speaker 0: Well, the

00:41:58.970 --> 00:42:01.450
Speaker 0: the piece of the the grief part is you're right.

00:42:01.450 --> 00:42:05.450
Speaker 0: You just don't know how you're gonna feel.

00:42:05.455 --> 00:42:09.455
Speaker 0: Actually, a piece of advice I got from a female family friend

00:42:10.015 --> 00:42:14.015
Speaker 0: was and it wasn't after my when my brother passed, almost

00:42:14.015 --> 00:42:18.015
Speaker 0: over twenty years ago or almost, was more for my father

00:42:18.630 --> 00:42:21.590
Speaker 0: because I think her her mother had passed a number of years before is

00:42:21.590 --> 00:42:25.270
Speaker 0: that, you know, you never you never really get over it.

00:42:25.270 --> 00:42:26.470
Speaker 0: You always grieve.

00:42:26.470 --> 00:42:26.790
Speaker 0: Mhmm.

00:42:26.790 --> 00:42:30.790
Speaker 0: It's just the the time frame of that grief gets shorter and shorter.

00:42:31.030 --> 00:42:35.030
Speaker 0: Like, when someone first passes, you could be a mess for days

00:42:35.485 --> 00:42:37.325
Speaker 0: or weeks or hours.

00:42:37.325 --> 00:42:41.325
Speaker 0: But over time, you know, you might just have that thirty second

00:42:42.205 --> 00:42:43.405
Speaker 0: bit of like, oh my god.

00:42:43.405 --> 00:42:44.445
Speaker 0: I really miss my dad.

00:42:44.445 --> 00:42:45.485
Speaker 0: And you get all emotional.

00:42:45.485 --> 00:42:49.485
Speaker 0: And then twenty nine seconds later, you break you you

00:42:49.530 --> 00:42:50.250
Speaker 0: get past it.

00:42:50.250 --> 00:42:52.890
Speaker 0: So it's more of the that is the one thing that I kinda learned,

00:42:52.890 --> 00:42:53.690
Speaker 0: and and it's true.

00:42:53.690 --> 00:42:56.250
Speaker 0: Like, over time, you still remember them.

00:42:56.250 --> 00:43:00.250
Speaker 0: You still grieve, but you don't get in that emotional state for an

00:43:00.305 --> 00:43:01.425
Speaker 0: extended period of time.

00:43:01.425 --> 00:43:01.745
Speaker 0: Right.

00:43:01.745 --> 00:43:04.225
Speaker 0: I think that was the one thing that I've I've learned.

00:43:04.225 --> 00:43:08.225
Speaker 0: But then all the stuff you gotta do to do with someone's passing.

00:43:08.385 --> 00:43:08.945
Speaker 0: Oh my god.

00:43:08.945 --> 00:43:10.625
Speaker 0: No one teaches you that.

00:43:10.625 --> 00:43:12.705
Speaker 0: That's like, what the heck?

00:43:12.705 --> 00:43:16.705
Speaker 1: It was interestingly, my dad died just before Christmas, and

00:43:16.890 --> 00:43:19.610
Speaker 1: so we, you know, we had this big gap of time to do we

00:43:19.610 --> 00:43:23.130
Speaker 1: started making a checklist and but, anyways, we eventually got to the funeral home,

00:43:23.130 --> 00:43:27.130
Speaker 1: and and the guy at the funeral home said, oh, here's a binder.

00:43:27.290 --> 00:43:31.150
Speaker 1: And he gives a binder of it was a checklist, essentially, but and also

00:43:31.150 --> 00:43:32.466
Speaker 1: everything we were supposed to do.

00:43:32.466 --> 00:43:34.221
Speaker 1: And I said, why they should give

00:43:34.221 --> 00:43:35.538
Speaker 0: it to you in the hospital.

00:43:35.538 --> 00:43:35.757
Speaker 1: Right.

00:43:35.757 --> 00:43:36.416
Speaker 1: Like Yeah.

00:43:36.416 --> 00:43:39.487
Speaker 1: Like, because you're gonna get it you're gonna get into it right away.

00:43:39.487 --> 00:43:39.707
Speaker 1: Right.

00:43:39.707 --> 00:43:41.901
Speaker 1: It's one of the things you just immediately start doing.

00:43:41.901 --> 00:43:42.200
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:43:42.200 --> 00:43:43.640
Speaker 0: But it's you know, I thought it was fascinating.

00:43:43.640 --> 00:43:45.800
Speaker 0: It was the funeral home that has that.

00:43:45.800 --> 00:43:48.440
Speaker 0: Like, they know, and they're so organized.

00:43:48.440 --> 00:43:48.640
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:43:48.600 --> 00:43:50.280
Speaker 0: And they're like, well, what yeah.

00:43:50.280 --> 00:43:52.200
Speaker 0: Why didn't someone tell me this beforehand?

00:43:52.200 --> 00:43:52.440
Speaker 0: Right.

00:43:52.440 --> 00:43:54.600
Speaker 0: You get to the funeral home, and they're like, oh, no.

00:43:54.600 --> 00:43:55.605
Speaker 0: This is what you need to do.

00:43:55.605 --> 00:43:55.805
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:43:55.765 --> 00:43:57.765
Speaker 1: Was it was he buried or cremated?

00:43:57.765 --> 00:43:58.645
Speaker 1: He was buried.

00:43:58.645 --> 00:43:58.885
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:43:58.885 --> 00:43:59.365
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:43:59.365 --> 00:44:00.725
Speaker 1: And and in Ontario?

00:44:00.725 --> 00:44:01.205
Speaker 1: Yes.

00:44:01.205 --> 00:44:01.605
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:44:01.605 --> 00:44:03.445
Speaker 1: What was that process like?

00:44:03.445 --> 00:44:07.445
Speaker 0: So he'd preorganize because my brother passed in two thousand and three, he'd already

00:44:07.605 --> 00:44:08.325
Speaker 0: bought a plot.

00:44:08.325 --> 00:44:11.820
Speaker 0: So my brother was there, and then he bought a plot for for for

00:44:11.820 --> 00:44:15.260
Speaker 0: himself and for mom and, actually, for me and my other brother.

00:44:15.260 --> 00:44:17.260
Speaker 0: So there's actually, like, five together.

00:44:17.260 --> 00:44:17.900
Speaker 0: Woah.

00:44:17.900 --> 00:44:19.340
Speaker 0: And my wife said Wait.

00:44:19.340 --> 00:44:21.260
Speaker 2: He bought all of those in advance?

00:44:21.260 --> 00:44:21.500
Speaker 0: Yes.

00:44:21.500 --> 00:44:21.980
Speaker 0: Oh, yeah.

00:44:21.980 --> 00:44:22.300
Speaker 0: Yes.

00:44:22.300 --> 00:44:22.940
Speaker 0: They give you a

00:44:22.940 --> 00:44:23.260
Speaker 1: deal.

00:44:23.260 --> 00:44:23.460
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:44:23.420 --> 00:44:24.060
Speaker 2: Was it a good yeah.

00:44:24.060 --> 00:44:24.700
Speaker 2: It was probably

00:44:24.700 --> 00:44:25.260
Speaker 0: a good sale.

00:44:25.260 --> 00:44:25.865
Speaker 0: Was.

00:44:25.865 --> 00:44:26.505
Speaker 0: Oh, I think so.

00:44:26.505 --> 00:44:29.785
Speaker 0: Because I think I I think I saw how much it cost, and, well,

00:44:29.785 --> 00:44:30.585
Speaker 0: that was back then.

00:44:30.585 --> 00:44:33.065
Speaker 0: And we think it would probably be five times as much today.

00:44:33.065 --> 00:44:33.585
Speaker 0: It's real estate.

00:44:33.585 --> 00:44:34.105
Speaker 0: You know?

00:44:34.105 --> 00:44:35.305
Speaker 0: It is real estate.

00:44:35.305 --> 00:44:38.840
Speaker 2: That's a much more what I think of as, like, traditional

00:44:38.840 --> 00:44:39.240
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:44:39.240 --> 00:44:42.600
Speaker 2: Scenario because a lot of your grieving, I think, sometimes is influenced by movies.

00:44:42.600 --> 00:44:42.840
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:44:42.840 --> 00:44:46.360
Speaker 2: Up until the point it happens, you're all you've seen probably is you maybe

00:44:46.360 --> 00:44:47.080
Speaker 0: again,

00:44:47.080 --> 00:44:49.320
Speaker 2: you've been you've either heard from somebody or

00:44:49.320 --> 00:44:49.520
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:44:49.400 --> 00:44:49.600
Speaker 0: I

00:44:49.480 --> 00:44:53.480
Speaker 2: don't even I thought about I realized I was just borrowing from Hollywood films.

00:44:53.485 --> 00:44:55.165
Speaker 1: And Guns N' Roses music video.

00:44:55.165 --> 00:44:55.365
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:44:55.325 --> 00:44:55.805
Speaker 2: Exactly.

00:44:55.805 --> 00:44:56.205
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:44:56.205 --> 00:44:56.405
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:44:56.285 --> 00:44:59.325
Speaker 0: But, no, we're all there, and you're standing there over the casket.

00:44:59.325 --> 00:45:02.205
Speaker 0: And there's a hole in the ground, and they're and they did lay it

00:45:02.205 --> 00:45:05.590
Speaker 0: down, and we put roses on top of the casket.

00:45:05.590 --> 00:45:06.150
Speaker 0: And you're right.

00:45:06.150 --> 00:45:07.590
Speaker 0: So it wasn't it was in April.

00:45:07.590 --> 00:45:11.110
Speaker 0: So it was, like, two months later after his passing that he actually got

00:45:11.110 --> 00:45:14.310
Speaker 0: buried buried, and then we all went out as a family.

00:45:14.310 --> 00:45:18.230
Speaker 0: And then, you know, my my older brother was right beside him.

00:45:18.230 --> 00:45:22.175
Speaker 0: And then and then because it's from the town my mom grew up, there's

00:45:22.175 --> 00:45:24.975
Speaker 0: all these relatives that are in the same,

00:45:24.975 --> 00:45:25.935
Speaker 2: So they all came?

00:45:25.935 --> 00:45:27.615
Speaker 0: They they all came, you know, in spirit.

00:45:27.615 --> 00:45:27.855
Speaker 0: Yes.

00:45:27.855 --> 00:45:28.655
Speaker 0: They were all there.

00:45:28.655 --> 00:45:30.175
Speaker 1: Standing on your burial.

00:45:30.175 --> 00:45:30.655
Speaker 1: Yes.

00:45:30.655 --> 00:45:30.975
Speaker 1: Yes.

00:45:30.975 --> 00:45:31.775
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:45:31.775 --> 00:45:33.210
Speaker 1: Exactly.

00:45:33.210 --> 00:45:33.930
Speaker 1: Exactly.

00:45:33.930 --> 00:45:36.010
Speaker 2: That does sound a lot like a Hollywood film with the

00:45:36.010 --> 00:45:36.490
Speaker 0: red rose.

00:45:36.490 --> 00:45:36.730
Speaker 0: Oh, yeah.

00:45:36.730 --> 00:45:37.530
Speaker 0: We found okay.

00:45:37.530 --> 00:45:37.770
Speaker 0: Yes.

00:45:37.770 --> 00:45:38.010
Speaker 0: We did.

00:45:38.010 --> 00:45:38.250
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:45:38.250 --> 00:45:41.850
Speaker 0: We put roses on his casket before it went down into the whole into

00:45:41.850 --> 00:45:42.650
Speaker 0: the ground.

00:45:42.650 --> 00:45:42.970
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:45:42.970 --> 00:45:43.450
Speaker 0: Interesting.

00:45:43.450 --> 00:45:43.770
Speaker 0: Hey.

00:45:43.770 --> 00:45:44.010
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:45:44.010 --> 00:45:44.810
Speaker 0: We we didn't get

00:45:44.810 --> 00:45:46.250
Speaker 1: we didn't get to experience that.

00:45:46.250 --> 00:45:49.955
Speaker 0: But there's not tons of people, and I don't think everyone was fully wearing

00:45:49.955 --> 00:45:50.755
Speaker 0: black.

00:45:50.755 --> 00:45:52.115
Speaker 0: Like, it was

00:45:52.115 --> 00:45:52.435
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:45:52.435 --> 00:45:53.635
Speaker 2: Some small nuances.

00:45:53.635 --> 00:45:53.955
Speaker 0: Yes.

00:45:53.955 --> 00:45:55.155
Speaker 0: There's some new ones.

00:45:55.155 --> 00:45:57.875
Speaker 0: No black veils, but there was limousine here.

00:45:57.875 --> 00:45:58.835
Speaker 1: Line of limousines?

00:45:58.835 --> 00:45:59.035
Speaker 0: No.

00:45:58.995 --> 00:45:59.955
Speaker 0: There's not a lot of limit.

00:45:59.955 --> 00:46:01.635
Speaker 0: I don't think there's a single limousine.

00:46:01.635 --> 00:46:02.200
Speaker 0: No.

00:46:02.200 --> 00:46:05.240
Speaker 0: And we we pulled up in cars, and I think we drove on other

00:46:05.240 --> 00:46:05.880
Speaker 0: people's grays.

00:46:05.880 --> 00:46:07.480
Speaker 0: Like, you know Oh, really?

00:46:07.480 --> 00:46:08.120
Speaker 0: Well, I don't know.

00:46:08.120 --> 00:46:09.400
Speaker 0: It's just kinda like this

00:46:09.400 --> 00:46:13.400
Speaker 2: I see why you're blocking this out.

00:46:13.880 --> 00:46:15.135
Speaker 0: They're like, where are we park here?

00:46:15.135 --> 00:46:16.655
Speaker 0: There's all these stones everywhere.

00:46:16.655 --> 00:46:17.535
Speaker 0: Where do we go?

00:46:17.535 --> 00:46:18.015
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:46:18.015 --> 00:46:20.575
Speaker 0: Where am I parked on?

00:46:20.575 --> 00:46:24.015
Speaker 1: So, Tiff, you've, you've been so generous with your time and and sharing so

00:46:24.015 --> 00:46:25.295
Speaker 1: many amazing stories.

00:46:25.295 --> 00:46:28.380
Speaker 1: We wanted to ask you a few kind of, you know, rapid fire type

00:46:28.380 --> 00:46:31.660
Speaker 1: sharing questions, which is odd doing rapid fire when talking

00:46:31.660 --> 00:46:32.220
Speaker 2: about thoughts,

00:46:32.220 --> 00:46:32.620
Speaker 1: I think.

00:46:32.620 --> 00:46:33.660
Speaker 1: Talking about yeah.

00:46:33.660 --> 00:46:34.060
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:46:34.060 --> 00:46:35.180
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:46:35.180 --> 00:46:38.540
Speaker 1: Curious, you know, what do you miss most about your dad?

00:46:38.540 --> 00:46:40.435
Speaker 0: He was just such a strong, good person.

00:46:40.435 --> 00:46:44.115
Speaker 0: I just I'm I actually, probably the thing I miss the most is not

00:46:44.115 --> 00:46:47.635
Speaker 0: being able to spend more like, I I miss the fact that I didn't

00:46:47.635 --> 00:46:50.275
Speaker 0: spend more time with him in his final days because I lived out here,

00:46:50.275 --> 00:46:51.795
Speaker 0: and he lived three thousand miles away.

00:46:51.795 --> 00:46:52.310
Speaker 0: Right.

00:46:52.310 --> 00:46:54.550
Speaker 0: So I think that's what I miss the most.

00:46:54.550 --> 00:46:58.150
Speaker 0: Like, I was thinking before coming here that,

00:46:58.150 --> 00:47:01.910
Speaker 0: you know, you you get into our age, and you're probably financially in a

00:47:01.910 --> 00:47:04.630
Speaker 0: better position than you were twenty years ago, or hopefully you are.

00:47:04.630 --> 00:47:05.030
Speaker 0: Right?

00:47:05.030 --> 00:47:07.830
Speaker 0: And there was a point in my last few years of my dad's life

00:47:07.830 --> 00:47:11.830
Speaker 0: where he was like he said that he one of his lifetime goals would

00:47:11.885 --> 00:47:13.245
Speaker 0: go to the Galapagos.

00:47:13.245 --> 00:47:13.645
Speaker 0: Mhmm.

00:47:13.645 --> 00:47:16.845
Speaker 0: And so I remember him telling me this, like, twenty years ago.

00:47:16.845 --> 00:47:17.165
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:47:17.165 --> 00:47:20.685
Speaker 0: And I was like and then about a number of years ago, I'm like,

00:47:20.685 --> 00:47:20.925
Speaker 0: jeez.

00:47:20.925 --> 00:47:21.885
Speaker 0: I'm in a position now.

00:47:21.885 --> 00:47:24.420
Speaker 0: I could financially take my dad to the Galapagos.

00:47:24.420 --> 00:47:27.780
Speaker 0: But now he's like but when I got to that position, it was like,

00:47:27.780 --> 00:47:28.500
Speaker 0: oh, he's too old now.

00:47:28.500 --> 00:47:28.740
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:47:28.740 --> 00:47:29.940
Speaker 0: He's in his age.

00:47:29.940 --> 00:47:30.260
Speaker 0: Frail.

00:47:30.260 --> 00:47:31.700
Speaker 0: And he doesn't want to do that.

00:47:31.700 --> 00:47:34.900
Speaker 0: He doesn't wanna go to the states because of health care costs and what

00:47:34.900 --> 00:47:35.220
Speaker 0: ifs.

00:47:35.220 --> 00:47:35.700
Speaker 0: Right.

00:47:35.700 --> 00:47:36.180
Speaker 0: Right?

00:47:36.180 --> 00:47:38.525
Speaker 0: So I was kinda like, so that's not gonna happen.

00:47:38.525 --> 00:47:39.725
Speaker 0: That's I'm really bummed out.

00:47:39.725 --> 00:47:39.965
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:47:39.965 --> 00:47:41.085
Speaker 0: I couldn't make that happen.

00:47:41.085 --> 00:47:43.485
Speaker 0: I wanted to make that happen for my dad.

00:47:43.485 --> 00:47:44.285
Speaker 2: So spending time.

00:47:44.285 --> 00:47:44.925
Speaker 0: Just spending time.

00:47:44.925 --> 00:47:45.885
Speaker 0: Just spending time.

00:47:45.885 --> 00:47:46.205
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:47:46.205 --> 00:47:46.605
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:47:46.605 --> 00:47:50.605
Speaker 1: Is there one thing you wish you said to him before he died?

00:47:51.290 --> 00:47:51.530
Speaker 0: No.

00:47:51.530 --> 00:47:53.770
Speaker 0: I because I think I said a lot of it over the years.

00:47:53.770 --> 00:47:57.770
Speaker 0: I'd always like birthday cards and Christmas and just I would write

00:47:57.930 --> 00:48:00.170
Speaker 0: my dad and say, dad, I'm thank you very much.

00:48:00.170 --> 00:48:02.170
Speaker 0: Thank you for being the person you are.

00:48:02.170 --> 00:48:02.570
Speaker 0: That's great.

00:48:02.570 --> 00:48:05.985
Speaker 0: You've helped me, I think, be a pretty good person.

00:48:05.985 --> 00:48:06.225
Speaker 0: Sorry.

00:48:06.225 --> 00:48:07.745
Speaker 0: That's something I'm tooting my own horn here.

00:48:07.745 --> 00:48:11.745
Speaker 0: But I think it's just he's just helped me be

00:48:12.065 --> 00:48:13.945
Speaker 0: who I am today, which I think is a positive thing.

00:48:13.945 --> 00:48:14.625
Speaker 0: So That's great.

00:48:14.625 --> 00:48:16.145
Speaker 0: I would thank him for that.

00:48:16.145 --> 00:48:17.585
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:48:17.585 --> 00:48:20.110
Speaker 2: Is there something that he did that bothered you?

00:48:20.110 --> 00:48:21.710
Speaker 2: And I don't mean, like, huge.

00:48:21.710 --> 00:48:25.710
Speaker 2: I just mean, like, my dad used to just constantly have this terrible expression.

00:48:26.110 --> 00:48:26.310
Speaker 2: Oh.

00:48:26.270 --> 00:48:29.470
Speaker 2: He'd say, a job worth doing is worth doing well, and

00:48:29.470 --> 00:48:30.510
Speaker 0: he would do it at the worst

00:48:30.510 --> 00:48:30.910
Speaker 2: times.

00:48:30.910 --> 00:48:31.150
Speaker 2: Right.

00:48:31.150 --> 00:48:33.975
Speaker 2: And he would just, like, I'd be sweeping, and he would do that.

00:48:33.975 --> 00:48:37.095
Speaker 2: And I'm kinda fascinated by there are sometimes these things

00:48:37.095 --> 00:48:37.415
Speaker 0: Right.

00:48:37.415 --> 00:48:39.735
Speaker 2: That that are there that live with you forever.

00:48:39.735 --> 00:48:43.735
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:48:44.710 --> 00:48:48.230
Speaker 0: There'd be times where he was just too damn serious in life, where he's

00:48:48.230 --> 00:48:49.670
Speaker 0: like, we gotta get this stuff done.

00:48:49.670 --> 00:48:50.790
Speaker 0: I'd be like, dad, fuck it.

00:48:50.790 --> 00:48:51.990
Speaker 0: Have a sense excuse my language.

00:48:51.990 --> 00:48:52.230
Speaker 0: No.

00:48:52.230 --> 00:48:53.190
Speaker 0: Have a sense of humor.

00:48:53.190 --> 00:48:53.510
Speaker 0: Come on.

00:48:53.510 --> 00:48:55.110
Speaker 0: Let's just it's okay.

00:48:55.110 --> 00:48:55.990
Speaker 0: Chill out.

00:48:55.990 --> 00:48:57.510
Speaker 0: It doesn't have to be done.

00:48:57.510 --> 00:48:58.310
Speaker 0: We can do that.

00:48:58.310 --> 00:49:00.115
Speaker 0: Like, just it's okay.

00:49:00.115 --> 00:49:00.435
Speaker 0: Enjoy.

00:49:00.435 --> 00:49:04.275
Speaker 0: I didn't see he was very serious.

00:49:04.275 --> 00:49:07.635
Speaker 0: He had a good sense of humor, but he didn't laugh as much as

00:49:07.635 --> 00:49:09.875
Speaker 0: I'd like to have seen him laugh.

00:49:09.875 --> 00:49:10.355
Speaker 0: Mhmm.

00:49:10.355 --> 00:49:11.880
Speaker 0: Because

00:49:11.880 --> 00:49:14.520
Speaker 0: and I think part of it is because I think he felt like it

00:49:14.520 --> 00:49:18.520
Speaker 0: was his responsibility to be serious and be

00:49:18.600 --> 00:49:22.600
Speaker 0: the man of the house and do things that help others.

00:49:23.480 --> 00:49:26.775
Speaker 0: And maybe sometimes laughter and joy wasn't part of that.

00:49:26.775 --> 00:49:28.455
Speaker 0: It was like getting things done.

00:49:28.455 --> 00:49:31.095
Speaker 0: And I think that's that old school sort of mentality.

00:49:31.095 --> 00:49:31.815
Speaker 0: Right?

00:49:31.815 --> 00:49:32.295
Speaker 0: Definitely.

00:49:32.295 --> 00:49:32.615
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:49:32.615 --> 00:49:34.055
Speaker 1: Yep.

00:49:34.055 --> 00:49:38.055
Speaker 1: What is something that you just immediately think about and start laughing

00:49:38.935 --> 00:49:41.360
Speaker 1: about when when it comes to him?

00:49:41.360 --> 00:49:45.360
Speaker 0: So so a funny story was that my wife

00:49:45.360 --> 00:49:47.120
Speaker 0: and I were visiting my parents.

00:49:47.120 --> 00:49:51.120
Speaker 0: And, at the time, I'm, in my thirties,

00:49:51.520 --> 00:49:54.960
Speaker 0: and my father's, I guess, at the time oh, jeez.

00:49:54.960 --> 00:49:55.920
Speaker 0: Somewhere in the seventies.

00:49:55.920 --> 00:49:56.755
Speaker 0: Whatever.

00:49:56.755 --> 00:49:59.395
Speaker 0: Anyway, this is before we had my wife and I had kids, and we've

00:49:59.395 --> 00:50:01.395
Speaker 0: been together, I think, six or eight months.

00:50:01.395 --> 00:50:03.155
Speaker 0: And we're visiting for about ten days.

00:50:03.155 --> 00:50:05.235
Speaker 0: I think it's about three days in.

00:50:05.235 --> 00:50:09.235
Speaker 0: And the cottage is about thirty minutes away from the closest

00:50:09.235 --> 00:50:09.555
Speaker 0: town.

00:50:09.555 --> 00:50:10.490
Speaker 0: And one day, I.

00:50:10.490 --> 00:50:13.290
Speaker 0: My dad's like, I'm running going into town to run some errands.

00:50:13.290 --> 00:50:15.370
Speaker 0: I go go to my dad on the side.

00:50:15.370 --> 00:50:16.890
Speaker 0: Hey, dad.

00:50:16.890 --> 00:50:18.970
Speaker 0: Could you get some condoms for me?

00:50:18.970 --> 00:50:22.090
Speaker 0: I mean, I had to get up the gumption just to ask my father.

00:50:22.090 --> 00:50:23.290
Speaker 0: I'm no I'm a grown man.

00:50:23.290 --> 00:50:26.195
Speaker 0: He's a grown man, but still, asking, you know, dad to go buy his

00:50:26.195 --> 00:50:28.835
Speaker 0: condoms is like I was like, I don't know.

00:50:28.835 --> 00:50:29.795
Speaker 0: He's like, oh, yeah, sure.

00:50:29.795 --> 00:50:30.355
Speaker 0: No problem.

00:50:30.355 --> 00:50:32.115
Speaker 0: Like, he didn't even blank.

00:50:32.115 --> 00:50:33.395
Speaker 0: Didn't even explain.

00:50:33.395 --> 00:50:34.675
Speaker 2: He didn't even blank.

00:50:34.675 --> 00:50:36.195
Speaker 0: He was only in Saigon.

00:50:36.195 --> 00:50:36.595
Speaker 0: Yes.

00:50:36.595 --> 00:50:38.355
Speaker 0: Yes.

00:50:38.355 --> 00:50:38.755
Speaker 0: Yes.

00:50:38.755 --> 00:50:39.510
Speaker 0: I'm very well.

00:50:39.510 --> 00:50:40.230
Speaker 0: I taught him well.

00:50:40.230 --> 00:50:42.150
Speaker 0: So he goes, and he comes back.

00:50:42.150 --> 00:50:45.270
Speaker 0: And, like, couple hours later after done all those errands, and he's like he's

00:50:45.270 --> 00:50:47.030
Speaker 0: like it's like, Tiff.

00:50:47.030 --> 00:50:50.870
Speaker 0: So go to the he's like, so okay.

00:50:50.870 --> 00:50:53.750
Speaker 0: Young, attractive woman that I had to ask to find out where they are.

00:50:53.750 --> 00:50:54.550
Speaker 0: That was odd.

00:50:54.550 --> 00:50:55.814
Speaker 0: I was like, oh, dad.

00:50:55.814 --> 00:50:57.432
Speaker 0: I'm sure you were a gentleman.

00:50:57.432 --> 00:50:58.781
Speaker 0: But I said, oh, yeah.

00:50:58.781 --> 00:50:59.321
Speaker 0: That's fine.

00:50:59.321 --> 00:51:00.939
Speaker 0: He's like, but I got it.

00:51:00.939 --> 00:51:02.018
Speaker 0: So we're all good.

00:51:02.018 --> 00:51:03.637
Speaker 0: And he hands me a box

00:51:03.637 --> 00:51:04.446
Speaker 1: of forty condoms.

00:51:04.446 --> 00:51:04.985
Speaker 0: At Costco.

00:51:04.985 --> 00:51:07.683
Speaker 0: And I was just like I'm like, thank dad.

00:51:07.683 --> 00:51:11.020
Speaker 0: I'm like really impressed that you think that's gonna happen happen that much.

00:51:11.020 --> 00:51:11.740
Speaker 0: I'm only here for

00:51:11.740 --> 00:51:13.580
Speaker 2: a few more days.

00:51:13.580 --> 00:51:15.740
Speaker 2: Can I here's a follow-up question?

00:51:15.740 --> 00:51:17.420
Speaker 2: They're sized.

00:51:17.420 --> 00:51:19.180
Speaker 2: Did he did he flatter you?

00:51:19.180 --> 00:51:20.247
Speaker 2: Or is he Punished

00:51:20.247 --> 00:51:20.940
Speaker 0: you.

00:51:20.940 --> 00:51:21.980
Speaker 0: Too he'd punish me.

00:51:21.980 --> 00:51:24.325
Speaker 0: It's a bit too realistic in my opinion.

00:51:24.325 --> 00:51:27.205
Speaker 0: The fact he gave me a box of forty, I was like, oh my

00:51:27.205 --> 00:51:28.645
Speaker 0: my wife thinks it's hilarious too.

00:51:28.645 --> 00:51:31.365
Speaker 0: She and I then I come back, honey, check out the size of the

00:51:31.365 --> 00:51:32.645
Speaker 0: box you bought.

00:51:32.645 --> 00:51:34.725
Speaker 1: Amazing.

00:51:34.725 --> 00:51:37.125
Speaker 1: If someone just lost their dad yesterday Yeah.

00:51:37.125 --> 00:51:39.750
Speaker 0: What would you say to them?

00:51:39.750 --> 00:51:40.310
Speaker 0: Wow.

00:51:40.310 --> 00:51:44.310
Speaker 0: They lost it yesterday.

00:51:44.630 --> 00:51:45.510
Speaker 0: Stay positive.

00:51:45.510 --> 00:51:46.950
Speaker 0: I think that's the number one thing.

00:51:46.950 --> 00:51:48.710
Speaker 0: Stay positive.

00:51:48.710 --> 00:51:49.590
Speaker 0: It'll be okay.

00:51:49.590 --> 00:51:51.685
Speaker 0: You'll get through it.

00:51:51.685 --> 00:51:53.125
Speaker 0: Well, Tiff,

00:51:53.125 --> 00:51:55.445
Speaker 1: thank you so much for sharing Yep.

00:51:55.445 --> 00:51:57.205
Speaker 1: George for introducing us to George.

00:51:57.205 --> 00:51:59.365
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for sharing your experience.

00:51:59.365 --> 00:52:03.365
Speaker 1: I think it's been incredibly valuable to learn about your experience, and

00:52:03.365 --> 00:52:07.365
Speaker 1: we really appreciate being as, you know, vulnerable as as you have been.

00:52:08.320 --> 00:52:08.880
Speaker 2: Absolutely.

00:52:08.880 --> 00:52:12.720
Speaker 2: I wanna say thank you as well because, again, top of the podcast, I

00:52:12.720 --> 00:52:13.280
Speaker 2: mentioned this.

00:52:13.280 --> 00:52:14.720
Speaker 2: You stepped forward right away.

00:52:14.720 --> 00:52:14.920
Speaker 0: Mhmm.

00:52:14.880 --> 00:52:15.600
Speaker 0: Right.

00:52:15.600 --> 00:52:18.960
Speaker 2: And things that I didn't know at that time that your mom had passed,

00:52:18.960 --> 00:52:22.095
Speaker 2: that your brother had passed, like, we're going through some time Right.

00:52:22.095 --> 00:52:23.535
Speaker 2: That you've had to.

00:52:23.535 --> 00:52:26.335
Speaker 2: And you're doing that with somebody with whom you don't know that well.

00:52:26.335 --> 00:52:28.895
Speaker 2: And so thank you for having the trust.

00:52:28.895 --> 00:52:29.215
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:52:29.215 --> 00:52:29.415
Speaker 0: The

00:52:29.295 --> 00:52:33.295
Speaker 2: trust that we could find some humor and find some interest and joy,

00:52:33.455 --> 00:52:36.050
Speaker 2: but also just to let us hear a little bit more.

00:52:36.050 --> 00:52:38.370
Speaker 2: And and I I really mean this.

00:52:38.370 --> 00:52:39.330
Speaker 2: I appreciate it.

00:52:39.330 --> 00:52:40.370
Speaker 0: Thank you.

00:52:40.370 --> 00:52:44.370
Speaker 0: Well, if I'd walked into some small dingy basement with crappy little

00:52:44.370 --> 00:52:45.890
Speaker 0: microphones, I'd be a bit more concerned.

00:52:45.890 --> 00:52:49.890
Speaker 0: But this is all, like, a professional

00:52:52.065 --> 00:52:52.465
Speaker 0: cover.

00:52:52.465 --> 00:52:52.665
Speaker 0: No.

00:52:52.625 --> 00:52:52.945
Speaker 0: Thank you.

00:52:52.945 --> 00:52:53.745
Speaker 0: Thanks very much.

00:52:53.745 --> 00:52:55.825
Speaker 0: Bathroom.

00:52:55.825 --> 00:52:56.225
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:52:56.225 --> 00:52:56.465
Speaker 0: No.

00:52:56.465 --> 00:53:00.065
Speaker 0: Actually, I and I think this is this is something my father would probably

00:53:00.065 --> 00:53:03.280
Speaker 0: have done for his father if the technology existed or probably did.

00:53:03.280 --> 00:53:05.920
Speaker 0: But, you know, he probably would have done the same thing if he's given

00:53:05.920 --> 00:53:09.920
Speaker 0: the opportunity because I think it's about, you know, respecting them and and

00:53:10.000 --> 00:53:11.520
Speaker 0: learning from them and Yeah.

00:53:11.520 --> 00:53:12.960
Speaker 0: Honoring them at some level.

00:53:12.960 --> 00:53:13.520
Speaker 0: Yeah.

00:53:13.520 --> 00:53:14.160
Speaker 2: Thanks so much.

00:53:14.160 --> 00:53:14.400
Speaker 2: Pleasure.

00:53:14.400 --> 00:53:14.600
Speaker 2: Thank

00:53:14.560 --> 00:53:15.200
Speaker 0: you very much.

00:53:15.200 --> 00:53:17.055
Speaker 0: Absolutely.

00:53:17.055 --> 00:53:19.055
Speaker 0: Appreciate it.